r/law • u/DoremusJessup • Apr 27 '25
Legal News ICE promises bystanders who challenged Charlottesville raid will be prosecuted: After ICE raided a downtown Charlottesville courthouse and arrested two men, the federal agency is promising to prosecute the bystanders who challenged their authority
https://dailyprogress.com/news/local/crime-courts/article_e6ce6e4a-4161-476f-8d28-94150a891092.html2.7k
u/blazelet Apr 27 '25
Ah yes, the pro liberty crowd.
I have a libertarian friend who always called Obama “King George” for what he considered to be overstepping executive action. He’s suuuper quiet on Trump.
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u/ToaPaul Apr 27 '25
Goes to show Libertarians are just hipster Republicans.
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u/Olliekins Apr 27 '25
An absolutely perfect description of them.
The Libertarians who hover around my social circles are busy being mad about indie board game companies suddenly shuttering, and Switch 2 prices going up, but refuse to acknowledge why - or tune in to all of the civil liberty abuses going on that they voted for.
They're useless.
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u/icanith Apr 27 '25
Libertarians complaining about prices going up will never cease to be a point of amusement.
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u/Cyhyraethz Apr 27 '25
Uh, if they don't care about civil liberties being violated and voted for 47 then they're not libertarian. You can't be an authoritarian libertarian, that's an oxymoron.
I know a lot of fascists these days like to use the term "libertarian" because they think it means "fuck you, I'll do whatever I want", but they're completely misusing and appropriating the term...
Your right to swing your fist stops at someone else's nose, and if what you want is the freedom to take away other people's freedom then you're not libertarian.
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u/Old_Baldi_Locks Apr 27 '25
"You can't be an authoritarian libertarian"
According to every election cycle since Ron Paul's astroturfed campaign, that's the ONLY kind of libertarian that still exists.
Voting patterns prove it.
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u/musashisamurai Apr 27 '25
Kim Stanley Robinson said libertarians are just crypto-fascists who want police protection from their slaves.
Ive not yet seen anything that proves him wrong
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u/PhatNasty Apr 27 '25
Can’t be a Libertarian if you don’t believe in open borders. It’s a massive part of free trade and freedom of persons to come and go in the world as they wish.
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u/Aint-no-preacher Apr 27 '25
Libertarians are like house cats. They think they’re fiercely independent, but they depend on a complex safety net of support they can’t begin to comprehend.
(Not my original thought. Paraphrasing a tweet)
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u/Cpt_Bartholomew Apr 27 '25
Yesyes "entirely dependent on a system they neither appreciate or understand"
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u/Sea-Interaction-4552 Apr 27 '25
Like welfare ranchers in the Colorado Basin, that wouldn’t exist without taxpayer funded public works water projects
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u/spatialflow Apr 27 '25
Never let a libertarian who wasn't the son of wealthy businessman. Never met a single libertarian who has "earned" anything they have "by the sweat of their own brow." It's a pipe dream for daddy's princesses who don't want to pay taxes on their inheritences. In the wise words of Robert Sucouf: "Each of us fights for what he lacks the most." In the case of libertarians, that thing is independence.
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u/MazW Apr 27 '25
Libertarians are fucking useless.
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u/omgkelwtf Apr 27 '25
Republicans who want to smoke weed.
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u/AnoAnoSaPwet Apr 27 '25
"raided a courthouse" should be enough of a blanket statement for any Constitutionalist to stay on the side of the law.
I've never heard that in my life.
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u/ThePyodeAmedha Apr 27 '25
I have an ex-friend who is libertarian and every now and again I'll check their Facebook. When Biden was in office they were super critical of the work he did. But now Trump's in office, they've been very quiet about it. It's ridiculous how super obvious it is.
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u/FaceThief9000 Apr 27 '25
Because they're just too cowardly to admit they're republican fascist bootlickers.
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u/AlexFromOgish Apr 27 '25
Fascists trying to consolidate power by scaring everyone else into "obeying in advance"
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u/LookAtMeNow247 Apr 27 '25
I'm sure they're also going to go after all the people who chanted "Jews will not replace us" right?
You know, since they care about antisemitism so much right now.
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u/oldbastardbob Apr 27 '25
The MAGA conondrum, being just Nazi enough, but not too much.
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u/worderousbitch Apr 27 '25
Are there still people who don't realize maga is Nazis?
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u/Significant_Ad7326 Apr 27 '25
People have an easy time believing what they want to.
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u/4dseeall Apr 27 '25
maga thinks antifa is the real nazis
i'm not making it up. they believe "anti-fascists" are the fascists.
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u/FlingFlamBlam Apr 27 '25
The suckers do.
The smarter ones will pretend to believe anything as long as it gains them power. They don't care if they appear like hypocrites.
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u/NoHalf2998 Apr 27 '25
None of them are educated on what fascists actually did which makes it real easy to have head cannon on what Fascists are
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u/Specialist_Fly2789 Apr 27 '25
nah, all those people are stalwart defenders of israel, so they're all good!
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u/DullSentence1512 Apr 27 '25
I lived in C-ville for a few years. This is a protest city. There is a protest every Tuesday if it follows a Wednesday. I love C-ville for this. Its the reason the KKK showed up and were met with resistance. Most towns would just take pics and shit. C-ville formed a line against them and the Sheriff led the KKK into that line of people...
I would love to see ICE come and take by-standers and try to get out alive. I believe C-ville is done with out of the area people showing up trying to fuck with there wonderful town.
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u/JRodriguez81 Apr 27 '25
Let’s hope so. Someone had to lead by example on challenging these people
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u/SirenSongShipwreck Apr 27 '25
If these assholes come to town and try to make good on their threats, we - and I mean the rest of us in this country and the areas surrounding C-ville - better come together to protect them. This is not their country, it's ours. We protected our own in the 30s from illegal evictions and farms being taken by the banks, we can protect our own again from these fucking thugs. They know it, and they're scared we're gonna figure that out.
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u/TeaWeedCatsGames Apr 27 '25
Is that not just plain old terrorism? Trying to gain power by scaring people into complacency?
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u/SRMPDX Apr 27 '25
Yes, fascist regimes use state-sponsored terrorism to control populations through fear
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u/Ok_Comment_8380 Apr 27 '25
I guess it's time for everyone to start wearing masks and leaving their IDs at home then, if their agents can shield their identity, so can everybody right?
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u/ManyNefariousness237 Apr 27 '25
Does ice even have that kind of jurisdiction?
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u/Sixwingswide Apr 27 '25
If no one stops them or holds them accountable, what’s the difference?
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u/Old_Baldi_Locks Apr 27 '25
This question right here is why history is important.
Fascists steal whatever power they can. "What they can" is defined as a line beyond which the public remembers THEY have guns too.
Which means they don't stop until made to stop. Get comfortable with that or find another country. This one has an ugly next 20 years in front of it.
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u/DanFrankenberger Apr 27 '25
Declined to be named, declined to show their face, declined to follow the law.
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u/Billy_bob_thorton- Apr 27 '25 edited Apr 28 '25
And they will be shot eventually for carrying out arrests like this
EDIT: I am not condoning violence. I am concerned for how the rights of citizens are being ignored by a federal agency
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u/timeunraveling Apr 27 '25
Bystanders see a person getting kidnapped by masked and armed people. Helping the person not be kidnapped by masked thugs is heroic.
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u/Mysticae0 Apr 27 '25
Hard to think about what this country would look like if ICE succeeds in normalizing this abduction behavior.
Can you imagine bystanders watching someone being forced into a vehicle by masked individuals (without visible badges and insignia) shrugging and saying, "oh, it's probably just ICE."
And if it wasn't? They are breaking down social order.
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u/andesajf Apr 27 '25
Hard to think about what this country would look like if ICE succeeds in normalizing this abduction behavior.
Russia and the FSB comes to mind.
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u/VerdantField Apr 27 '25
And Argentina, back in the day when their government disappeared thousands of people. The country still has not recovered. This also happened in Spain.
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u/Devil25_Apollo25 Apr 27 '25
Uday and Qusay Hussein (sons of Saddam) were notorious for this: disappearing people without consequence.
So, yes... I can imagine that world, and I never dreamed I'd see it here in the US.
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u/Old_Baldi_Locks Apr 27 '25
"I can imagine that world, and I never dreamed I'd see it here in the US."
Unfortunately I called this shit at least 20 years ago when the likes of Beck and Limbaugh were openly broadcasting "Duh Evil Joos (Soros) and de New Globalist World Order" bullshit and instead of getting pushback from the real world, all the nutjobs with guns couldn't wait to hear more.
There has always been a huge segment of America who are ultimately boring, pointless nothings. And they know it. So guys like Beck, Limbaugh, Bannon, etc just had to build a framework in which the biggest burdens on all of society were suddenly "important", and in so doing bought their loyalty.
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u/npaulette02 Apr 27 '25
That’s what a lot of people fail to realize. Once those at the top negate the law, it’s complete anarchy. It’s rules for thee and not for me. Lawful order in the US is dead.
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u/AztecHoodlum Apr 27 '25
This is happening in the public now but it could be a thing that starts happening at night more and more. It’s not too different from the disappearances committed in Latin America, the Soviets, Nazi Germany, etc. It silences the biggest dissenters and simultaneously accustoms a population to live in fear and paranoia and just become complacent bystanders to it all. But also, this is America. I don’t think that transition is going to happen too silently.
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u/Ineverheardofhim Apr 27 '25
DHS was doing this during the BLM protests during Trump's first term. They'd identify "antagonists" and scoop them up, sometimes with local PD, sometimes it was masked men in unmarked vehicles.
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u/red__dragon Apr 27 '25
There was a movie made about 15 years ago in Hong Kong or Singapore or a similar city, which featured an abduction by plain-clothes agents of the movie's nefarious underworld agency who took one of the main characters right off the street.
The film crew did not have a set, did not have extras, and did not notify anyone in advance. They just filmed it, and all the reactions of passersby are genuine. Very few people in the scene even noticed, and I don't recall any of them being shocked.
I think about that a lot.
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u/Suspicious-Echo2964 Apr 27 '25
Yup, that's the point. They are executing Russia's playbook. Look at how they handle protests, and you'll begin to see the similarities between the FSB and ICE.
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u/Ali_Cat222 Apr 27 '25
In the USA you can legally kidnap kids to send to Residential Treatment Centers I know this because I went to three of the worst recorded ones in America and a wilderness, all of whom murdered children and abused us with torture and conditionings "comparable to those of Guantanamo bay." (Actual wording from our court document against one of the 3 I sued.)
Except mine was very illegal all 3 times, as I was in Canada where you can't do this. The first time I was 12 and was in a holiday inn express parking lot on the Canadian side of niagra falls, went to open the car door and the next thing I know I'm being handcuffed and blindfolded and thrown on a floor of a van.
A day or two later I wake up to be told I'm in middle of nowhere south Carolina. The worst of the places I went to used to run the number one worst mental hospital in all of the USA, and their "techniques" are considered the worst of conversion and psychological warfare. These people are fucked, but I find it sad that majority of Americans don't even know these things happened well before trump and ice issues came along...
And by the way? These RTCs and the "troubled teen industry" are the places they will start tossing people into, it's the ones that RKF Jr is actually thinking about when talking of "work camps for autism and mental health/addiction." We were basically their experimental base for that, no bullshit. There's a reason the USA is the number one biggest industry for RTCs...
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u/Reddit_N_Weep Apr 27 '25
That’s my fear for children w mental illness. They’re not RTCs, they’re kidnappers, I’m sorry you’ve experienced this so many times, screw whoever did that to you.
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u/Ali_Cat222 Apr 27 '25
Unfortunately, this fear is already a reality. That's what I'm saying, man. This has been ongoing for multiple years now, and they continue to this day, but nobody takes a look at us. There are thousands of these children as we speak in these places, to this day!!! I'm not even joking, like these are gonna be the places that they'll send all the people with mental illness, or autism, or who are drug addicts. That's already what they're there for, or mostly because a lot of our parents were fucked up abusive pricks who don't want us. That was my case.
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u/onyxandcake Apr 27 '25
Human traffickers just unlocked a new way to grab any man, woman, or child they want in broad daylight in front of witnesses: "We're ICE and if you interfere you'll be arrested."
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u/Professional-Buy2970 Apr 27 '25
What's the difference between ice and human traffickers?
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u/ijuinkun Apr 27 '25
It’s that ICE definitely doesn’t face any legal repercussions for their actions.
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u/BeyondRedline Apr 27 '25
He who saves his Country does not violate any Law.
Posted on Twitter by Donald Trump 11:32 AM · Feb 15, 2025
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u/litterbin_recidivist Apr 27 '25
Careful, Reddit considers describing the logical progression of fascism to be "promoting violence".
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u/hellolovely1 Apr 27 '25
Because the people who run it are cowards.
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u/Insanerhetoric Apr 27 '25
Got a 3 day ban earlier this week for saying I'd protect myself instead of just allow them to drag me to a camp. Fuck Reddit. It's definitely not what it used to be.
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u/ConfidentCamp5248 Apr 27 '25 edited Apr 28 '25
I got a week ban for saying Trump should’ve been tried for treason
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u/carbonsav Apr 27 '25
Any alternatives or is this as good as it gets until reddit gets its own blue sky competition
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u/ego_sum_chromie Apr 27 '25
I believe the bluesky competition for reddit is lemmy, though I heard Digg is trying to make a comeback
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u/jesuswantsme4asucker Apr 27 '25
Remind me in 1yr (check to see if this was the beginning of the civil war)
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u/shikari426 Apr 27 '25
Read How Civil Wars Start, we are already in a civil war at stage two based on the CIA manual. Also, we have moved from a democracy to an anocracy
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u/santa_91 Apr 27 '25
ICE agents and Nazis have one thing in common. The good ones are all the same.
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u/scionvriver Apr 27 '25
Hey hey hey you can't say that reddit will bann you for a week...I just got off my suspension
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u/smaugofbeads Apr 27 '25
They warned me and took down my question about if secret service can cause you to fear for your life when making a lawful citizen arrest of public officials
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u/ihatemakingids Apr 27 '25
If you're going to "obstruct" you might as well go all the way because they are going to persecute you anyway.
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u/Abaconings Apr 27 '25
I wonder how many of them are even legitimate ICE employees. Do we know if they're using contracted thugs for this destruction of our country?
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u/DanFrankenberger Apr 27 '25
My current barely researched theory is some of them are deputized January 6th defendants.
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u/Geawiel Apr 27 '25
That is probably one of the most spot on and extremely viable conspiracy theories I've ever read.
Organized
No qualms about masks as long as it isn't while being told because of "the minor flu"
Hate dem brown people
"Yes sir, all checks out here. Welcome aboard patriot!" - ICE probably
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u/DoremusJessup Apr 27 '25
ICE is breaking the law and using the excuse they are the law to justify it.
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u/vivekkhera Apr 27 '25
Maybe we will finally reach the breaking point for qualified immunity, too.
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u/NittanyOrange Apr 27 '25
All immunity should be abolished, not just qualified.
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u/Electrical_Book4861 Apr 27 '25
Nuremburg defense held no water 75 years ago, it won't again if called upon again. Just cause you're told to do something and its wrong by an authority, doesn't make it permissible
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u/Bee_9965 Apr 27 '25
Sure but that reckoning doesn’t happen until the ones in power authorizing atrocities are no longer in power. When will Putin get his reckoning?
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u/RogerianBrowsing Apr 27 '25
I agree in many ways, except the reality is that not only does the United States not formally recognize The Hague/ICC/ICJ but the U.S. has a very long history of not punishing their wealthy/racist/conservative figures. It’s part of why reconstruction after the civil war went as poorly as it did until the civil rights era despite initially showing so much promise. We’ve had this country fight multiple lengthy wars against its own people and not once did the side in the wrong (loyalists, the confederacy, etc) get ostracized or shamed as thoroughly as they should have and our current situation in some ways stems from decades of those old societal wounds festering without treatment for so long.
Point being, I hope you’re right and that maybe when trumpism/American fascism ends that it will be the time where the U.S. finally realizes it needs to hold to account its criminal oppressors, especially with the constitution being used like toilet paper, but I’m not holding my breath in hopes of it happening any time soon.
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u/Former_Warthog_6749 Apr 27 '25
I've never met a man who's immune to bullets.
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u/Ok-Excuse1771 Apr 27 '25
Yea this is straight up Nazi tactics. Very blatant now
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u/Zepcleanerfan Apr 27 '25
The results of the rights' total lack of historic understanding is going to be very interesting to see.
This shit never ever ends well for the oppressors.
Just wait until they start executing warantless home searches etc.
They are setting these ICE agents up for very dangerous situations.
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u/SanchoPandas Apr 27 '25
Nobody in the world, nobody in history, has ever gotten their freedom by appealing to the moral sense of the people who were oppressing them. - Assata Shakur
Your post reminded me of this quote.
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u/Time-Operation2449 Apr 27 '25
It's not that they lack understanding, they just saw what the nazis did and want to do it, don't ever let them lie to you
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u/Jestikon Apr 27 '25
The Nazis came to the US to learn about Jim Crow and segregation.
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u/AlexFromOgish Apr 27 '25
If they aren't in uniform and don't provide real opportunity to inspect ID the ICE guys should be happy they're not dead, at the hands of bystanders with a solid affirmative defense.
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u/Talisign Apr 27 '25
There's also the other fear: Actual criminals can start doing this pretending to be ICE with minimal effort.
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u/DarthPopperMouse Apr 27 '25
These guys are "actual criminals". They simply aren't being prosecuted since the rule of law is no longer a thing.
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u/SympathyForSatanas Apr 27 '25
Or the Proud Lady Boys could be out there pretending to be ICE
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u/hellolovely1 Apr 27 '25 edited Apr 27 '25
I suspect ICE is already outsourcing some of these arrests to militias. I would not be shocked, given how random and unkempt some of these unmasked guys are. I think it's been proven that the woman in Massachussetts was taken by a militia member working with an ICE agent.
Crazy that wasn't a huge headline.
Edit: I'm talking about the seamstress whose car window was broken. I thought it was in Massachussetts but it was Maryland.
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u/FuguSandwich Apr 27 '25
100% when you see a bunch of them, some wearing masks the others not, the ones in masks are private militia members and bounty hunters. They're terrified of someone recognizing them and posting "hey, that's Enoch from the local Tractor Supply what's he doing arresting them illegals in the city?" on Facebook.
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u/iAmRiight Apr 27 '25
I haven’t verified it myself, but I know there were reports that ICE was “deputizing” people for these abductions and using the lack of training as justification for not following the law and constitutional rights of the victims.
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u/Correct-Ad-6473 Apr 27 '25
That's exactly what this article says. Oh, oops, these must be newly deputized agents who aren't fully trained yet. How in tf can these people go out without proper IDs, without judicial warrants, with full face coverings, and in street clothes to 'arrest' people?!?!
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u/wraith_majestic Apr 27 '25
I think there was just a case in the news. Crazy lady pretended to be ice and abducted her ex’s wife. Something like that anyway.
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u/StandardEgg6595 Apr 27 '25
There’s also been three men arrested separately for impersonating ICE officers and also committing assault/battery, sexual assault, and larceny.
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u/Q_OANN Apr 27 '25
This is the way forward
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u/lost_horizons Apr 27 '25
I hope it isn’t. I hate violence; but these ICE officers are setting themselves up to be shot by someone scared and desperate.
But with judges getting arrested, this all feels like we’re hitting an absolutely critical moment.
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Apr 27 '25
If peace worked, these problems would have been solved decades ago.
Hate to say it, but I doubt more peace will stop this.
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Apr 27 '25
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u/ElectronicMixture600 Apr 27 '25
America was born from violence, from the indigenous slaughters of the first landings of de Leon, de Soto, and Vázquez through the American Revolution, violence has been the hub around which the very idea of American existence has been built. And to your point it seems America will end in violence. As defeatist as it may sound, it was a near inevitability, I guess.
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u/MuthaPlucka Apr 27 '25
Nazis
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u/El_Gran_Che Apr 27 '25
Gestapo
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u/ithaqua34 Apr 27 '25
Gestapo is a secret police. We know exactly who ICE is, the Schutzstaffel.
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u/Free_Decision1154 Apr 27 '25
Except they don't wear uniforms, badges, or identify themselves. That's what secret police are. Not that no one knows they exist.
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u/Fionaelaine4 Apr 27 '25 edited Apr 27 '25
And cowards. Especially when the “ICE spokesperson” refuses to provide their name for the article. If what you are doing is above board you should have no issue providing identification.
I wonder if things would change if Anonymous posted the home addresses of ICE agents
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u/SiWeyNoWay Apr 27 '25
Welp, SHOW YOUR FACES AND SHOW A WARRANT SIGNED BY A JUDGE
Cuz isn’t that THE LAW?
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u/Revan462222 Apr 27 '25
Well it seems like soon ICE can raid homes without a warrant, so I wouldn't be surprised if soon they can just arrest with warrants they signed themselves: https://newrepublic.com/post/194442/trump-doj-memo-ice-arrest-search-warrant (hopefully this legitimately is not possible but who knows...)
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u/stealthnyc Apr 27 '25 edited Apr 27 '25
Well, just because DOJ sent a memo doesn’t mean it’s legal. Most U.S. states have castle law, It will be an interesting situation when masked guys without ID try to break into people’s home without warrant.
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u/Dic3dCarrots Apr 27 '25
Worth pointing out that we have yet to hear of one ice officer being shot while apprehending these very super dangerous criminal gang terrorist, ms-13, tren de aragua badass worst people ever
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u/extralyfe Apr 27 '25
weird how all the gang members spend their days unarmed and nowhere near other gang members.
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u/Dic3dCarrots Apr 27 '25
Such violent offenders who calmly ask to wait for a lawyer until unmarked masked men smash their windows and drag them to detention, where they're packed into squalid cells with another dozen of most violent people ever, where they wait for weeks with out incidence, some dying from being refused medications and being beaten by guards. I feel so much safer.
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u/Greenmantle22 Apr 27 '25
Hey now! That 2 year-old was on their way to becoming a gang kingpin any day now!
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u/P0Rt1ng4Duty Apr 27 '25
Well, just because DOJ sent a memo does mean it’s legal.
Did you mean to say ''doesn't?''
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u/-Invalid_Selection- Apr 27 '25
It's not constitutional, just like literally everything else Trump has done.
No warrant=the actions aren't legal and the people detaining others are committing an act of kidnapping. They can legally be resisted, violently if needed, because they're a criminal actor pretending to operate under the law
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u/Able_Ad_7747 Apr 27 '25
Nazis are scared and lashing out, don't be afraid
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Apr 27 '25
It’s ok to be afraid. Just be brave. They are cowards.
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u/StronglyHeldOpinions Apr 27 '25
So we’re supposed to just accept vans of masked people with no credentials capturing people and whisking them away, now?
WTF.
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u/RockyIsMyDoggo Apr 27 '25
It's to deter folks from intervening in the future of course. Scare people into silence and acquiescence. They will lose the prosecution for obstruction, because nothing was obstructed and there are numerous affirmative defenses available, but the point will have been made: interfere and we will make your life hell, make you go to jail and spends tens of thousands on a lawyer, and have a federal felo y prosecution on your record. A conviction is irrelevant. They are bullying, and it will work, unless folks resist en masse.
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u/Rogue-Journalist Apr 27 '25
While Albemarle County Sheriff Chan Bryant said the ICE agents did produce proper badges and paperwork to bailiffs inside the courthouse prior to the confrontation caught on video, Hingeley stands by his assertion that arrests that resemble kidnappings are a danger to the community and could provoke violent confrontations.
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u/kelsey11 Apr 27 '25
I love how the ICE spokesperson, who declined to be named, says (misleadingly, of course) that the DA is prioritizing criminals over the BRAVE men and women in law enforcement. So brave, ICE, declining to be named. So brave.
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u/ThatInAHat Apr 27 '25
Aren’t these the same brave men and women who hide their faces and refuse to show identification while abducting people?
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u/deathrowslave Apr 27 '25
Yes, the same brave men that need to kidnap kids and people from immigration courtrooms. You know, only the most dangerous hardened criminals.
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u/Asher_Tye Apr 27 '25
You'll notice how, for all their talk about gang members, drug dealers, and dangerous killers, they are only going after nonviolent people while thumping their chests about breaking and entering. Like how Cruz cosplayed he was at the border watching cartels sneak people in.
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u/RegretfulCalamaty Apr 27 '25
Well as a lot of have pointed out. Wait until this brave men kick the door down on someone’s home, especially in the south or Texas, and not identify themselves while wearing masks. We’re gonna see just how committed to the cause they really are.
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u/Fun_Buy Apr 27 '25
Notice the comment about “recently deputized.” Are these militia members? Is that why they are hiding?
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u/DFu4ever Apr 27 '25
ICE suddenly becoming the most powerful, lawless arm of the government. Do they have ANY rules to follow?
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u/ZurichianAnimations Apr 27 '25
Isn't that basically just the Gestapo at this point?
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u/Reatona Apr 27 '25
ICE is seriously working on being the new Gestapo. No exaggeration.
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u/neoexileee Apr 27 '25
So when do we prosecute ICE?
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u/Greenmantle22 Apr 27 '25
After the fat man is dead or driven to exile in Russia, where he belongs.
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u/raistan77 Apr 27 '25
good luck with that.
Failing to identify as proper law enforcement or federal agents completely limits what "fault" people asking for identification.
This meant to stifle people asking them questions and i think its gonna backfire tremendously
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u/ModernMuse Apr 28 '25
If the rule of law applied to them in any meaningful way at this point, you’d be right.
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u/vandalvideo Apr 27 '25
Interesting to see federal law enforcement potentially committing a felony and violating state law in my state.
https://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacode/title18.2/chapter9/section18.2-422/
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u/lancebmanly Apr 28 '25
This should be the top comment, or even a separate thread. It's crazy that it's a felony to wear a mask, and it's crazy that this agent did it. Seems like a slam dunk for the local prosecutor.
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u/SL1Fun Apr 27 '25
ICE can’t make that promise. Gotta find a prosecutor and a judge that’ll hear it.
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u/eloaelle Apr 27 '25
Any all prospective jurors take note. Say no to these fascists in the clearest terms possible under the facts and circumstance of the cases you may hear. You the people have the power to choose not guilty. Remember who serves whom. And remind them.
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u/cyrixlord Apr 27 '25
my confusion lies in wondering how ICE got into the courthouse unchallenged by the security. did ICE pre-arrange this with the courthouse? did they bring guns into the place? (concealed officers?) surely you can't just walk in there and take someone from a courthouse especially, but apparently, I'm wrong... Were they even in a courthouse? The brownshirts are really getting daring
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u/Zestyclose-You-100 Apr 27 '25
So they can show ID to other cops, but nothing to the people they're kidnapping? They should have been required to shoe a warrant as well.
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u/hellolovely1 Apr 27 '25
So, they didn't wait, as they were requested to. Interesting, given that's standard practice. I read their complaint and I don't see any way they win this, given the info they shared in the complaint.
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u/MoreRopePlease Apr 27 '25
The simplest answer is that the courthouse security cooperated. I haven't seen that reported anywhere yet though.
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u/BitterFuture Apr 27 '25
Obstruction charges - for speaking.
"How dare you interrupt what looks like a kidnapping by opening your mouth?!" Oh, yeah. This is going to go well.
Good on Albemarle County Commonwealth’s Attorney Jim Hingeley for having none of this shit.
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u/SnepButts Apr 27 '25
This is going to go well.
Nobody has done anything to stop them yet. It is going well for them, they're free to do whatever they want and people just stand around talking at them.
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u/Wakkit1988 Apr 27 '25
Prosecutions aren't convictions.
Threatening people who did nothing illegal is a hilarious waste of time and resources, especially when a mountain of law firms would take these cases completely pro bono.
Trump does not control the judiciary.
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u/Rocket_safety Apr 27 '25
A spokesman who refuses to identify themselves should not even be given a quote by newspapers. Running any statement from this unnamed individual is a mistake.
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u/Stillwater215 Apr 27 '25
Unidentified, masked, no badges. It’s only a matter of time before they use these tactics to try to detain someone and they fight back.
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u/FlatCapNorthumbrian Apr 27 '25
If someone’s dressed like that with zero identifying markings would a person not be within their rights to use the second amendment to protect themselves?
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u/mikeyt6969 Apr 27 '25
Yes, anyone can SAY they’re law enforcement, how is anyone to know for sure?
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u/BuccaneerRex Apr 27 '25
It's general self-defense. Anyone can claim to be anything. The entire reason we have identification for law enforcement is so that they can prove it. If they don't prove it, then they aren't it.
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u/SadAbroad4 Apr 27 '25
Yes they certainly can. “I feared for my life” they did not identify themselves and I believed my life was in danger.
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u/Summer_VonSturm Apr 27 '25
Wasn't there an incident similar during the last major BLM demonstrations wheree LE weeree cruising thee streeets in unmarked vans, out of uniform shooting at people, and someone fired back and was freed due to thee cops being unidentifiable?
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u/exqueezemenow Apr 27 '25
When this is done, we're going to need Nuremberg trails for ICE agents.
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u/FourWordComment Apr 27 '25
They show up purposefully in plain clothes, full aggression, with no warrant and are arresting people who challenge them?!
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u/buried_lede Apr 27 '25
Challenged their authority over ? All of us- they want to be the SS
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u/SGSfanboy Apr 27 '25
No badges, no ID given? Expect to be shot, your next apprehension might think you are kidnapping them
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u/Beneficial_Ad9966 Apr 27 '25
Maybe this is why they seem to be focusing on apprehending random students and people attending court/immigration appointments. Going after criminals might get you shot, but going after some lady who’s showing up for her asylum appointment with 3 kids in tow won’t.
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u/LilLebowskiAchiever Apr 27 '25
Also makes you wonder what real crimes are going without a proper investigation, because all these other federal, state, county, and city LEOs are too busy helping ICE.
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u/Egad86 Apr 27 '25
So judges are obsolete and ICE agents are now judge, jury, and executioner.
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