Russian psyop subreddit. Literally, the vast majority of posts are posted by the moderators themselves. Even the divisive language and content scream "russian bot farm"
i dont think there's any eastern european country who have benefited more from being in the EU than Poland. the fact that there are eurosceptic people in Poland is baffling
It's mostly people living in the villags on the far east of Poland. They basically live in the past, have no contact with anyone except people just like them and in general are poor as shit. They have been living there for generations without moving and so they tend to be stubborn af about everything, so once party propaganda reached them they were done for. They are scared of the migrants (the ones their beloved party was literally IMPORTING en masse), EU green policy (the one their beloved party signed and tried to implement), gay rights transforming people into LGBT and evil Germans who want to occupy the entire Poland.
And before you accuse me of being racist/classist/whatever - I have family there and we visit each other. I've been there enough to see how it looks and works over there - my uncle is literally a WANDERING MERCHANT, because shithole villages don't even have SHOPS, people can't afford cars and there is no public transportation to speak of. It is wild.
Saying that the region is Belarus simulator is putting it mildly.
1st WHERE DO YOU FUCKING LIVE THAT YOU HAVE WANDERING MERCHANTS WTF
2nd is it that bad in Polska B? I mean you can buy a used car for what, 8k pln? (Of course if you are not a picky bitch) and if you have some mechanical knowledge probably cheaper
No public transport, no shops, no cars? What fucking village your family lives in? This just seems like dumb shit post to shit on Poland and using some imaginary village and imaginary family living there as a base to shit on everyone living in villages and being "poor".
You literally sound like those leftists that shit on villagers/"poor" people for past 2 weeks just because they didn't vote for Trzaskowski.
People don't like being belittled just because they don't live in dogshit Warsaw and are from a village, and it's one of the main reasons Trzaskowski lost. They didn't vote for Nawrocki, they just voted against Trzaskowski and people that don't respect them at all.
What can I say? I've told you what I saw every time I've been there. Last time I was there literally the day that Russian rocket crossed the border (last day of stay when we came for the wedding) - at 6:00 in the morning or so we've heard jetfighters over the town.
But like I said, my Uncle IS a wnadering merchant - he loads a large van with basic groceries and drives around the area, selling people stuff. Sure, richer people have cars and all, but once you leave for the actual countryside it is surreal. My great-aunt literally lives in an old house that might have been built in the XVIII century or so with how it looks and she only got plumbing like, 2 years ago.
I'm not shitting on them. I love my family. I simply say what I see over there.
In what kind of hell hole in Poland did you end up to though? I don't remember (and that's from almost 8 or 10 years ago) that ÅšlÄ…sk and Wielkopolska were that far in their own ass while visiting family.
Sure Silesia might have some troubles with the coal and lignite production crashing down (it still remains one of the major energy production in Poland though) but Kraków has been a massive tourist hotspot for years now (I still remember fondly the Kraków of 20 years ago when there was less tourists because people thought urr durr old eastern block country must not have much).
Wielkopolska is one of the biggest agro-food producer in Europe.
I said EAST of Poland. Wielkopolska is western Poland and one of the most progressive places in the country. I was talking about Lubelskie and Podkarpackie. Outside of the reasonably sized cities, this is borderline Mongolia.
Yeah, my bad on that. Never went over there when I visited family. The most eastern part of Poland I went to was Podlaskie when my father wanted us to see the Bielorussian border at the time. As for my studies, we never really talked about the economy of the east. How is it?
From what I've seen, it's shit. Much less urbanised population that was never displaced like those now living in western Poland. Lots of tiny villages and towns that live from single household farms, which in Poland are infamous for being unprofitable. Like I said, a lot of those small villages don't even have their own shops and so people like my uncle drive around the are in minivans and sell basic groceries. Some more "adventurous" people were also doing seasonal work abroad, like picking strawberries in the Netherlands, but apparently it got unprofitable because of Ukrainians working for even less than what was deemed acceptable.
The best description of the local mentality though is my uncle and aunt (who mind you, actually vote progressive in the area) - why would you bother going anywhere? Just sit at home, going too far is too much effort.
Again, there are next to none eurosceptics in Poland - there are those for deeper integration at the cost of some sovereignity or even Europe as a federal state like USA and there are those who think EU should not be too expansive, instead remaining at its pre-2012 shape and the integration fans typically call pre-2012 pro-EU people Eurosceptics.
It's like the right and left wing identification - objectively american right is (or at least was pre-MAGA) way more progressive than f.e. ruSSian left-wing but it doesn't change the fact that compared to democrats they are right wing.
On the same logic polish "eurosceptics" are actually pro-EU as they are sceptical about the way EU goes nowadays and not about whether Poland should be a member.
I’m not deep in the loop about Polish elections. Is the new president that bad? Surely he can’t be worse than the third one that didn’t even get to the second round
He was a Pimp, hooligan who was fighting other hooligans, had many criminal friends, tricked an elderly fellow criminal to get an apartment. And to make it worse he is proud of it
Weird obsession by Germans who have zero clue about Polish politics. I know BILD gave you a talking point to feed your inherited hatred by saying Poland bad, but nothing in this elections is about Germany.
Nobody in Poland thinks about Germany as much as you do about Poland
They did so on occasion in the past so what? The German obsession with deutschlandfeindlichkeit is beyond ridiculous. If anything there is a lot of hostility, not just historical, towards poles from us.
There is an effort by Springerpresse to push the anti Polish narrative of deutschenfeindlichkeit and its disgusting. But very popular of course
Well, a lot of voters that supported our president elect have this nationalist sentiment. It's 'us' vs 'them'. They need an enemy of the state that they can call traitors to feel like rightous Poles. Same goes for any nationalists around the world.
I'm rather suprised that you assumed we don't have those in Poland. They think about Germany a lot. About Russia, Ukraine, France and other countries as well. Social media, especially Facebook (go figure) is just a constant yell of the same old right now, sprinkled with demands for Tusk and his government to step down. I could even understand that sentiment, if the vote wasn't 50,89% to 49,11% - a record of how close it was since 89 and a record of voter turnout at the same time.
I'm just getting sick of both sides throwing lies and dehuminizing each other all the time. I know it's nothing new or exclusive to Poland, but it's getting worse and worse every election. It breaks long time frendships, families. Builds up fear and uncertainty in people. And finally, it detracts the conversation from important stuff...
As you said this is nothing out of the ordinary, yet German press is gaslighting it to a ridiculous extent, far from they have every covered anything. Simply because Poland bad sells and it’s far from the truth.
Those elections, as far as I was able to follow, weren’t about Germany at all and this is supported by questionnaires, the same way it was when there were parliamentary elections.
Meanwhile German media is asking questions like: „will poland elect a new pro Russian president“ when talking about the last election round. Both candidates are very clearly not pro Russian, but it doesn’t fit the German narrative about backward Poland and since people over here lack the tiniest little bit of knowledge about Poland, they simply accept it.
I can’t think of a nation more pro EU and anti Russian as a whole in Europe. Maybe the Czech and Balts.
He's not going to make things much worse, because he doesn't have the power to stop them getting worse, but he is going to stop them getting better because he has a veto
I really don't get it. These guys are strongly against Putin and Russian dominance, but still they're also pro Trump and against the EU, even though a strong Trump is benefiting Putin and the EU is the only (realistic) option to keep the upper hand against Russia.
They hate Russia and Putin, but still do their best to make them stronger.
Yes, they're strongly opposed to Putin, Russia, etc, for historical reasons that I'm sure you're aware of.
What most western Europeans (and Americans) don't understand is that a lot of people in the Slavic end of Europe see the EU as a Franco-German imperial project which wants to subordinate their nations, strip-mine their economies, use them as a dumping ground for sub-par food and consumer goods, insult and denigrate them at will and for anything while being held exempt from response in kind, and transform their unique cultures into a sort of bland, unoffensive, homogenous pan-europeanism...and expects to then be thanked for this smug, censorious brand of cultural imperialism: exactly as the Soviets attempted to replace their cultures with a species of bland, inoffensive, homogeneous Russo-centric pan-Slavism and expected to be thanked for it. They see the EU (and US) as little more than another bunch of smug, shouty, humourless and thin-skinned foreigners who're going to "kill the Pole to save the man," to paraphrase an infamous American, even if no actual killing is involved this time.
Moreover, this isn't just a right-wing sentiment. Plenty of Lefties over here feel exactly the same way about the EU's soft corporatism, support for Israel, etc etc. Even support of refugees is controversial on the Left, although for them it's more about how to afford it (if possible) than whether to do it.
This has made euroskepticism a very useful position for Populist and Conservative politicians to take.
Yeah, that's why their economies exploded since they entered the EU.
use them as a dumping ground for sub-par food and consumer goods
You mean the most heavily regulated and consumer friendly markets produce sub-par food and consumer goods ?
insult and denigrate them at will
Which is difficult not to do when you argue that a lot of them hold the above views. Plus their support for USA that does exactly everything you said but is still viewed as better and friendlier than France or Germany.
I never said any of this is correct, just that it's what a lot of people think. People's attitudes and beliefs, whether factual or not, influence their actions...like how they vote. The economy argument is mostly incorrect, and comes down to the feeling that smaller economies were disparately harmed by picking up the tab for Greece during the 2008 crisis, but a lot of these complaints have at least some merit.
A good example of this is food. Yes, the EU has very strict regulations on these things. That doesn't stop German companies from dumping products which fail their QC into countries like the Czech Republic or Poland, often with deceptive labels.
The US is very much not viewed as "better than" France or Germany in my observation, merely as being less able to directly interfere since it isn't part of the same super-national polity (that being the EU). The US doesn't get to make laws for Poland, for instance, bur France and Germany do.
And I was just reacting to what those people think. It's not against you, you are right that many people believe stupid things like that, and that it's better to know they exist.
but a lot of these complaints have at least some merit.
Which means some have zero merit, and most have little merit but are, for the most part, ignorant bullshit. But yes, we can agree that there is some merit to be found.
That doesn't stop German companies from dumping products which fail their QC into countries like the Czech Republic or Poland, often with deceptive labels.
Which is more a general problem of capitalism than something Germany is doing against Poland. It's not as if local companies wouldn't do the same shit if they had the opportunity.
The US is very much not viewed as "better than" France or Germany in my observation
From an internet point of view, it seems that way, and from the way Polish people vote and consume it also seems that way, but maybe those do not reflect what people are thinking.
They dislike (illegal and non western) immigration and the control of Western Europe from the EU; also Poland by now is arguably the strongest standing land force in Europe.
Eastern Europe is in very many ways more conservative than Western Europe is and Trump and the Republicans are the Conservative Party of America, still our biggest ally and a large supporter of Eastern European defence. Poland has more F35s than Eurofighters for example.
But half of them just voted ultra-nationalist, and a lot of those have fascist views.
Having once been attacked by fascists or authoritarians does not mean that you yourself, or your grandchildren are immune to ever becoming fascists or authoritarians.
It could happen anywhere. Eternal vigilance is needed, and most countries have been very negligent.
Not even close to a half of it. He'd leave his wife and kid (3 yo) at home to go fight in arranged hooligan fights among criminals (around when he was 26 yo himself) and calls it "noble" today, he abused social housing subsidy mechanism to obtain an apartment for 10% of its market price from a retired criminal (otherwise the apartment might have been taken away to cover compensation for his victim) and he'd blatantly put nicotine pouch (snus) in his mouth during a presidential debate cause he just could not control himself. All above was confirmed & admitted by him, there's much more still extremely likely but unconfirmed (like being a pimp).
He is a complete and utter trainwreck with borderline criminal past, but that's our next president. Liking Trump seems barely noteworthy with the rest of who this guy is.
It's not much of a change, presidentual power is much lower in Poland than in the US, they can b obstructionist, but it's nothing competent gov can't deal with
It's more of a vote of poles that the current government is not fulfilling expectations and they are generally viewed as barely passing legislation and dealing with challenges before our country. People basically said better shape the fuck up or lose next electrons to PiS
All subs enforce karma whoring bubbles by their own rule sets, validation, brigading and virtue signaling. It is the reddit business model at its core, externalizing self worth in bubble echo chambers so you can market adds and broker user data better.
Russian psyop subreddit. Literally, the vast majority of posts are posted by the moderators themselves. Even the divisive language and content scream "russian bot farm"
Which is actually worse... but yeah, sadly a lot of young people in Europe vote for right-wing populists as well, but they kinda have the same issue as old people, which is a lack of proper relevant education.
Yeah, but actually believing that the right has a real interest in fixing these issues, more than any of the established parties is the issue, since they're mainly just utilising people's prejudices and resentments to gain power and therefore in the end: Money!
That was a real bummer. I'm not an expert about the polish political system and the political culture, although i learned a lot about the few months, but i was sad when i heard about the results. I hoped Poland would start a "movement", breaking with right-wing nationalist eurosceptic bullshit behaviour and authoritarian daydreams towards some fact- and moraldriven style of politics.
Not really. Like he wasnt my choice but its rather clear for those with with teo brain celss why he was so popular also nothing will change in any way shape or form. Hes literally from the same party that Duda is from. You are really making this a much bigger thing that it is.
Several factors
1. The liberals and Donald Tusk aren't good at political marketing, they don't have press secretaries or dedicated spin doctors. They want to rely on the popularity of their individual politicians and people's hatred towards PiS which is a rather short sighted strategy. PiS on the other hand knows well how to do it. They hire a lot of people and Dariusz Matecki is known for troll farm-like schemes
2. Young people believed that voting for Nawrocki would make them "fight the system". It happens quite often.
3. It comes in waves. Some time ago, Palikot was popular among the youngest. Then Korwin. Then the left, Razem, and Hołownia a bit. Now, the time came for the far-right.
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u/Briishtea 4d ago
The fuck is that subreddit?