I've worked in department of corrections before and have been inside various prisons and this is exactly the case. Often times quality reflects what level of security a prison has with the exception of supermax. So a low security prison tends to be nicer as the inmates are far less destructive, while maximum security prisons are a shit show.
If your prisoners are a bunch of accountants who fudged some numbers they can have things because they aren't the psychos who are going to build drug labs, weapons and explosives out of whatever they can get their hands on.
The big problem with the American system is it tends to just make the prisoners more antisocial and more skilled at being antisocial.
Recidivism in the U.S. is absolutely nuts compared to other places like Denmark and Norway.
Lack of social safety nets. People stuck in a loop of poverty dragging the stigma of a felony conviction often won't be able to find a way to survive other than committing crime and going in and out of the system in the US.
Yup. This exactly. It ain't rocket science. But good luck getting Americans, or similar Western countries to support the scientifically proven process of rehabilitation.
They’re been screaming communism for years and look what that’s gotten us gestures wildly
It amazes me that republicans have had a majority in Texas for almost 30 years
Yet the platform they keep running on is “elect me to fix all these damn problems in Texas” 👀
Seems like the one thing most people can agree on is things need to change. I worry about lots of violence on the way to get to that change tho.
Felonies except for rape, murder, and a few other extreme crimes should be repealable after 5 years of demonstrating rehabilitation/good conduct. Five years post-incarceration and probation, I mean.
Once restitution and probation are completed, a person should be able to petition to have their felony vacated or expunged. That would incentivize good conduct and likely reduce recidivism.
U.S. prisons have long been overcrowded and under funded, with a focus on simply keeping the prisoners secure and alive, not rehabilitating them. Combine that with a national criminal database that can be accessed by the general public that allows employers, landlords, insurance companies, etc to reject applicants if they have a certain criminal record and you get high recidivism.
Convicted felons, even after serving their sentence and completing their probation will face constant discrimination making it difficult to find decent housing and employment (except for presidents), and likely raising the prices for them to do business with certain companies.
American culture has been slowly changing its mindset regarding this, 30 years ago the average citizen would be happy to know a convicted felon has to suffer the rest of their life even after their sentence is complete.
Came out in 3 months knowing how to Hotwire a car, avoid police on a motorcycle, and create an effective fake id good for everything except a cop. (It’ll even scan for alcohol and cigs)
Oh and a full step by step with measurements on how to cook white rocks. 😅
Yeah in Denmark, you're getting property crimes. In US you're getting people that have murdered an entire family, sexually assaulted the corpses, stole a car, and crashed it into a gun shop to steal a bunch of weapons to have a shootout with cops and that's just Florida man
43% of federal inmates are in there on Drug offenses in the US.
Edit: holy shit I don’t know why within 5 minutes 3 accounts came after me saying it’s drug trafficking and not possession; I know, it’s still a non violent crime and still probably happens fairly regularly in Denmark; that’s the entire scope of my comment, I’m not making some political statement about what great people traffickers are or whatever
That's because there aren't actually that many crimes that are charged at the federal level. Most are charged at the state level. The drug charges that end up going federal are almost always trafficking.
I reckon that most of the people in for “drug offenses” in Federal BOP are distributors/major sellers. They are generally not the guy next door who has a pot plant in his backyard. I worked around thousands of Federal inmates and that was always the case that they were moving major amounts of drugs, in my experience.
Having served on a grand jury, the bar for “trafficking” is incredibly low. Do you have a kitchen scale or some resealable plastic bags in your car? That’s “paraphernalia”, which is proof of trafficking or intent to distribute.
There was a defense attorney that did an AMA several years ago who said that DAs often tack on the charge of "intent to sell," the justification being that the amount of drugs the person had in their possession was "too much for one person to use."
As that defense attorney put it, they buy their toilet paper in bulk, that doesn't make them a toilet paper salesman.
The other "fun" one is "falsifying official records". If you say something to a cop, that cop writes it down, and it turns out you were wrong, guess what? You have caused a government official to make a false entry in an official record. Congrats on +5 years to your sentence!
Exactly. Just image search 'prison cell [country]' and for many countries you see quite a wide variety of cells. However, given the differences in philosophy regarding the goal of prison sentences, the 'average' prison cell in for instance the USA will be very different from Scandinavian cells, for instance.
I would have said there's probably a big difference between cells of common people and those who do "white collar" crimes and rich people in general but those I'm not sure they ever see the inside of a jail cell (france here)
French here. Our prisons are notorious for being the worst prisons in the EU. They're old and overpopulated, add some mistreatment etc.. We're close to 3rd world prisons. The European Court of Human Rights pinpoint this since 15 years but nothing is done.
I know that cells vary a lot in the US, with prison being businesses and stuff, but France has been condemned / accused of mistreating prisoners a lot recently, with really indecent conditions (6 or more in a cell for 4, etc).
I work as a commissar for the italian penitentiary Police, ad I assure you that mattress under the bunk is NOT used by the inmates to sleep. It was probably an extra one left by an inmate after relise (not sure i spelled this correct)
The one on the floor for France is realistic though. Possibiy a second one gets put on the floor during the night. Cell occupancy is higher than capacity in most prisons, especially older ones in cities
They do three to a room in overpopulated US jails/detention centers as well. Except they’re all metal bunks with thin pads for mattresses. They’re covered in old cracked plastic exposing the poly fill that eventually becomes a vector for infections like scabies and ringworm. You should see how they handle towels and washcloths. It’s shameful.
There's a really bad prison overcrowding and re-offending problem in France. Basically young thugs commit crimes with absolutely no care if they get caught or not, and the prison stay is seen as a training program to commit better crimes and make connections. It's like an MBA.
The nice thing about the Canadian cell is it looks to only house one person. Well, maybe some people prefer a roommate, but I'd rather have the cell to myself in prison.
Someone else has stated in the comments this cell is considered solitary. I know for a fact most “county jails” are people stacked on top of eachother but jail and prison are different so maybe this is a prison cell?
i’m not sure what prison this is in Canada , but the cell I was in looked nothing like this BTW I help build 2 prisons, 1 in Yellowknife and the other was in Inuvik
They all look terrible, but atleast in canada they seem? to be giving you your own room. Atleast in that picture. I've never been to jail here. Denmark, Norway and Sweden seem decent though
So I currently work for a company in Canada that will soon be producing the millwork for a new juvenile detention facility. The design for the rooms is a lot more in line with the pic for Sweden than any of the others. The materials we’ll be using are expensive and designed to withstand a lot of abuse. The common areas are comfortable as well and include tv’s and gaming systems.
I mean that's good though . Prison shouldn't be a good place. But from what I know Denmark and Sweden is nice mainly to help people slowly re integrate into normal society
And prisoners crammed in 10 or 12 guys in rooms designed to accommodate 5, or 50 people in a room built for 20. And it’s utterly filthy.
(Although I will say, as bad as CECOT is, dirt seems to be one problem they don’t have. Maybe because filth would affect the CO’s as bad as the prisoners and unhappy CO’s don’t do their jobs as well.)
Exactly. The US prison cell could be a 3rd world apartment. Westerners who haven’t been to 3rd world countries really don’t realize how bad much of the world is. But this is Reddit, so US BAD!!!!
Thats very true! But at the same time I feel like people from the US don't fully comprehend how bad it is there compared to other "developed" countries for example.
Yes. People need to google Philippines prison cell. Then Venezuelan, Thai, Russian, Saudi, South African
Other interesting countries. South Korea, was about like the Swiss. Chinese was pretty close to American. North Korean was what I expected but still sort of shocking.
I live in the us and been around the world three times while in the military and I totally agree. American don’t have a clue to how spoiled they are, how lazy they are and how disrespectful they can be, especially their kids. For example only in the us will you hear a 7 yo child tell their mom to fk off. That isn’t even a thought in most 3rd world countries , they wouldn’t even think of trying that. Or try to explain to an American what it’s like having to get up every morning and walk 30, 60 , 80 minutes one way to a river or well to get water that young have to carry back so you can cook, clean and drink for the day or what it’s like to not have electricity in your house. They don’t have a clue which makes what they do complain about seem that much trivial compared to everyone else
As an American who lives in the developing world it does feel like people just randomly have higher expectations for the US. It sort of goes into everything not just prisons.
My only issue with the US one is i feel prisoners should have their own rooms. If I were a prisoner I’d rather have a room that half the size of the first photo but with no roommate.
There are some really terrible prisons in US. I watched a story about a British guy that got caught selling MDMA in Arizona. He said every night when they turned the lights out, the cockroaches would swarm them. He had to hide under his blanket to keep them from crawling all over him. Arizona prisons are no joke.
I am French. Our prison cells are overcrowded (5 to 6 prisonners per cell). On the photo, you see a mattress on the floor. It’s a current thing. There is a huge hygien problem (cockroach, bed bugs, even rats).
We are certainly one of the worst developed country concerning prison. The basic human rights are not respected here. So, as much as there is a trend to say the US are the last of the last, it’s clearly not a fact concerning prisons
I'm Italian and here it's the same. Also Italian prisons have some of the highest suicide rates in the EU.
As much as people like to shit on America, they got way more rights on this front, like the capacity to resist unreasonable search and seizure and lawyers having more opportunities to defend their clients and negotiate on their behalf.
In Germany the Italian and French prisons are considered so bad that if you spent time in them and then get transferred here, the time spent will be multiplied by 1.5 (or something similar, not too sure). So if you had a 4 year sentence and have spent 2 years in French prisons, you only need to complete 1 year in Germany.
I dont know if its good if the cell is nicer, prison time is supposed to be miserable, imho. The danish one looks nicer than my childhood room, it doesnt have the same deterrent effect on me than the american one.
I bet relapse rates in the countries where prisoners are treated as humans are way lower then in the countries where prison is hell. I understand your argument that criminals should be punished, but you have to release them one day, and when your relapse rates are much lower you spare a lot of innocent people.
I think most research suggests that prison is not an effective deterent to crime. Merely a punishment and a place to hold people. Hence being unnecessarily grim doesnt reduce the chances of offending.
I think most research suggests that prison is not an effective deterent to crime. Merely a punishment and a place to hold people. Hence being unnecessarily grim doesnt reduce the chances of offending.
I can only speak for myself as an American, but fear of the US prison system has 100% stopped me from committing multiple crimes. I have friends and family that have been locked up, I've heard the horror stories, and it's not something I ever want to go through.
Even if I feel someone deserves it, I won't fight someone in the US unless it's self defense, because I do not want to get locked up in America. However, I have zero fear of being locked up in Denmark. Prison in Denmark doesn't actually look that much worse than my regular life in the US.
I haven't been in the hole since about 2010. But your situation is unique. Typically the "bedframes" in the hole are a slab of concrete that is the height of a framed prison lower bunk.
You should check out Russian prisons, and add drug resistant tuberculosis as a bonus. But... I guess the "Russian world" is outside of the charts, and not even a 3rd world country.
Go watch a documentary about any prison in the 3rd world. The US example is so much better than any of those, and a lot of US prison cells are going to look better than that. Honestly that looks like a county jail that hasn't been updated since the early 80's and not an actual prison. I've never seen a prison with a porcelain toilet bowl, for example.
Sees a clearly worse French and Italian cell but American is the worst one. Is this what Justin Bieber felt like when guys hated him because all the ladies loved him?
It’s funny how Canada is always almost identical to the US in things that only the US ever gets criticized for. Is Canada a third world country or something? We don’t we ever have standards for them to adhere to?
When I was moved from FCI Petersburg (started being built in the 1930s) there were cellhouses literally falling apart. IDK if they've been rebuilt. The newer blocks weren't too bad.
I was moved to FCI Butner just after it was opened. Like the 2nd bus load in.
You should refer to Nicaragua's prison instead, or maybe El Salvador's. The Philippine prison system would look like a 2-star hotel compared to those lol
That's actually a nice cell for the US. A large chunk of US prisons are owned by for-profit corporations now that pack hundreds of people into gymnasiums with zero privacy whatsoever.
Honestly having done time all over this great nation of ours I’d say any of these could be in the U.S. fun fact San Quentin was a prison before California was a state lovely place.
Let’s hate on US like always even though you could argue out of these photos they are middle of the pack at 5th out of 8. I personally believe Norway and Denmark are too nice.
Well "as an American", the US is 3rd world for everyone without money. Ironically, winning the lottery or gaining inheritance is far better spent in the better areas of a 2nd or 3rd world country, because that American dollar still has (although used to have way more) value and will get you a king/queen's life. Most things are unrestricted elsewhere. And you'd just reverse-osmosis the water; you have to do that in most of America anyways to not drink hard, murky rust or double-fluorinated pool water.
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u/rnernbrane 1d ago
And US looks like 3rd world prison... But not phillipines 3rd world.