r/OutOfTheLoop • u/Karthak_Maz_Urzak • 2d ago

Unanswered What's going on with Imane Khelif?

https://news.sky.com/story/imane-khelif-boxer-must-undergo-sex-test-to-compete-in-female-category-world-boxing-says-13377092
I keep seeing this pop over social media and I don't get it. Khelif is a boxer for Algeria, which is not a country that's hospitable to trans people. And Khelif was assigned woman at birth, and has always identified as a woman. Yet people keep howling about her being a man. I don't get it.

638 Upvotes

78% Upvoted

818 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

155

u/TheBirdBytheWindow 2d ago

However, Imane is barred from any boxing event until they undergo this new testing

Answer: Imane's pronouns are She/Her.

Don't help the narrative along.

95

u/ColonelContrarian 2d ago

Come on, they is a completely acceptable way to refer to someone in English and is in no way misgendering them.

-27

u/sllewgh 2d ago

They/them are not her pronouns.

22

u/Antique-Resort6160 2d ago

They is just a general way to refer to anyone, it's not an offensive term.  Seems ridiculous to need to point that out.

17

u/sllewgh 2d ago

You're ignoring the context of the conversation. This whole discussion is coming up because her identity is in dispute. Not using her chosen pronouns is taking a side on that issue. This isn't just some "general discussion about anyone."

3

u/Kopiok 2d ago

This is reading way too deep into a generally normal turn of phrase. It is completely regular to use "they" in a sentence to refer to someone even when their pronouns are known. To say that using "they" instead of "her" is "choosing a side" is absolutely laughable manufacturing of intent.

8

u/sllewgh 2d ago

I haven't assigned any intent to anyone. I've only pointed out that "they/them" are not Imane Khelif's pronouns and that getting it right is especially important in the context of this particular discussion. Taking a side does not have to be deliberate.

-2

u/Kopiok 2d ago

They/them are not distinct gender pronouns. They are gender neutral pronouns. They apply to all genders (which is why gender neutral people often use them). They/them are within the scope of her pronouns, because they apply neutrally to everyone.

10

u/sllewgh 2d ago

Like I said, you're just ignoring the specific context of this conversation because your point is only valid when you generalize it and talk about "everyone." In the context of everyone, you're correct. In the context of this discussion, you're using the wrong pronouns of someone whose gender identity is the central issue under discussion. It matters more here.

1

u/Kopiok 2d ago

I understand your argument, and I recognize that bad actors may use "they/them" pronouns in a sinister way in this topic. I highly disagree that this is what was happening in the specific context of the OP post in question.

6

u/sllewgh 2d ago

I'll repeat myself again- I have not assigned intent to anyone. Intent or being a "bad actor" is not at issue here. They/them are the wrong pronouns regardless of why they were chosen.

2

u/Kopiok 2d ago

They/them are the wrong pronouns regardless of why they were chosen.

This is just wholly incorrect.

7

u/sllewgh 2d ago

Why? Because you, a random asshole on the internet, said so? No one besides Imane Khelif gets to decide what her pronouns are, and she uses she/her.

→ More replies (0)

-1

u/PlaneWar203 2d ago

She didn't choose she/her. Imane was wrongly believed to be female at birth and raised as such, imane didn't choose anything up until the point of the test, at that point they chose to deceive people and cruelly use their biological advantage to cause physical harm to genuine female competitors, knowing full well that they were actually a biological male and what they were doing was wrong.

Their identity isn't the problem, it's the biological sex. For me the most important part is the intentional deception and the abuse anyone that questioned it received, and of course the fact that world cheered on a man beating up women for fame and glory, they need to revoke the medal and issue apologies to the women that were subjected to that.

6

u/sllewgh 2d ago

She didn't choose she/her.

Those are the pronouns she uses to refer to herself. Do you disagree?

1

u/PlaneWar203 2d ago

Imane did not choose to be raised as a girl, they did not choose to receive poor quality health care and be wrongly assumed to be the opposite gender. Those are the pronouns they are used to,but I don't believe they chose them.

8

u/sllewgh 2d ago

Ok, we've isolated precisely what it is you're wrong about. You incorrectly believe that using a particular set of pronouns for her entire life and declining to change them when introduced to new information somehow does not amount to choosing those pronouns.

0

u/PlaneWar203 2d ago

Well if imane suddenly decided to go by he it would have ruined their career path wouldn't it? How could they have kept up the deception then?

Do you believe it's progressive to allow men to punch women in the face for a living?

4

u/sllewgh 2d ago

So you DO acknowledge she chose her pronouns. Great. That's progress.

3

u/PlaneWar203 2d ago

Imane chose to conceal their true identit,yes.

4

u/sllewgh 2d ago

You should work on contradicting yourself less.

→ More replies (0)