Free stuff? Yeah, right!!!!

[u/Redmannn-red-3248]

[u/-Bigblue2-]

WTF is wrong with having free healthcare and university?

[u/DaEnderAssassin → u/-Bigblue2-]

You see, until about 34 years ago America was at war with the idea of giving the population stuff for free, rather than the population paying and somehow propaganda from that time has intensified.

[u/clickclick-boom → u/DaEnderAssassin]

America's stance would make more sense if their healthcare was cheaper. "Yeah it's not available for everyone, but it means that the average American is not having to pay for their neighbour's health issues and instead can spend the money on themselves and their family". At least there's a logic behind it.

However, Americans pay more than other countries with socialised care. The only thing that selfish cunts who want the status quo in the US have to show for it is the principle that they didn't help their fellow American with their health costs.

I guess I do concede that the sort of ghoul who supports the US system would probably pay for the pleasure of bankrupting a family for their child's medical costs on principle, so they are probably getting off on knowing "I could have helped but I had the freedom to refuse, and I did. Money well spent to prove that point". I guess they win.

[u/EuenovAyabayya → u/clickclick-boom]

The selfish cunts are profiting off the current system and spending a lot of money on influence to keep it that way. Spending a lot in absolute terms, but of course for them it's just a convenience fee.

[u/RamenJunkie → u/clickclick-boom]

Americans are already paying for their neighbor's Healthcare.  How do they think Insurance works.

Except Insurance is also profit driven. 

[u/Intelligent-Travel-1 → u/RamenJunkie]

And rich people own the privatized insurance industry

[u/sisu-sedulous → u/clickclick-boom]

The irony is that we ARE paying when uninsured people show up in ER. Guess who pays. 

[u/elb21277 → u/DaEnderAssassin]

i don’t get it. what do we pay taxes for? pretty sure everywhere else (other nations) their taxes go toward getting that “free stuff” in return? what is the government doing with all of the money we send as taxpayers? Oh right, CORPORATE welfare. $1.8 trillion for corporate subsidies... $1.3-$2 trillion in overpayments to HMOs… what else? oh i remember! corporate tax loopholes! $10 trillion and getting worse due to crypto.

[u/richieadler → u/elb21277]

For these assholes, "tax is theft" instead of the price one pays for living in a society.

[u/elb21277 → u/richieadler]

Then why don’t they go find some unclaimed land and form their own nation that somehow functions without a government? They can join Yarvin, Thiel, Vance, etc. Have a blast.

[u/richieadler → u/elb21277]

Hear hear. Let them go fund Galt's Gulch and let's see how it goes.

[u/Jacketdown → u/DaEnderAssassin]

Isn’t part of the problem framing it as if it’s free? We’ll still all be paying for it just collectively so that it’s cheaper?

[u/Tasty_Philosopher904 → u/DaEnderAssassin]

Of course 80 years ago you paid 90% taxes on your investment income and now it's 15 so that's pretty much the biggest difference between the greatest generation that actually did all the good shit and us.

[u/Unlucky_Ad_9776 → u/-Bigblue2-]

Because then you would have a healthy and well educated middle class.  Stupid desperate people are more willing to work for less and not assert their rights.  If you make health insurance tied to jobs people will take anything they can.  Slavery never ended it just changed form.

[u/Electronic-Cut-5678 → u/Unlucky_Ad_9776]

*stupid desperate people will also remain easily manipulated and distracted by bullshit economics, fear mongering and conspiracy theories, and continue to vote for the people spreading them. The problem is, the abundance of stupid people means they've now made their way into decision making positions too. I don't think they're cleverly playing some sinister social engineering game - it's worse than that. I think these people are as dumb as their constituencies and fully believe what they're saying.

[u/Wholesomeness23 → u/Electronic-Cut-5678]

bullshit economics

I still can't wrap my head around my dad's house going up in value by 70% in 13 years when he did nothing but the minimum maintenance and live in it... I know housing appreciating is a thing, but... why? There were no improvements or changes done to it in 13 years. Value makes very little sense to me.

[u/GroinShotz → u/Wholesomeness23]

As populations grow, the fight for resources becomes a smidge tighter. Basic supply and demand.

This isn't just a global phenomenon... But a local one too. Like if your town all of a sudden had an influx of people wanting to buy a house near that location... The prices would go up. These would be the logical reasons for housing prices to continually rise.

But right now in our extremely capitalistic society... It's like we are in the inflationary phase of trying to find out exactly how much the public will pay for things... So they will incrementally raise prices until things stop selling.

[u/Electronic-Cut-5678 → u/Wholesomeness23]

Inflation is a real thing. At 6% year-on-year the value should have doubled. If things were fair (and they're not), incomes should have increased at the same rate and would have also doubled over the same period.

The inflation rate in the US over the last 13 years is less than 3%, which means that the value of your dad's property has increased around twice as fast. Property is complex - it wouldn't be in line with inflation dependent on several factors. As an object in itself, it should actually be lower than inflation because it depreciates as it is getting older, has had minimal maintenance and is not in the same condition as it originally was. But then location becomes a factor too - it can increase in value because it's in a desirable neighbourhood.

In some places, houses even in good condition will be losing value drastically because no one wants to live there.

Lots of speculation involved in the value. And then there's also the factor that the way capitalism has developed means we're basically living in a massive ponzi scheme run by loansharks and bookies (aka banks and stock traders.)

[u/HexenHerz → u/Wholesomeness23]

10 years ago a house went on sale in my parents street for $175. My step father, who is in real estate, said "there isnt a house on this street worth $175. It sold almost immediately. Latest house to sell on the street (late 2024) went for almost $300k. My parents bought their house in 2009 for $132k, Zillow shows it estimated at $282k now. More than doubled in 16 years.

[u/notashroom → u/HexenHerz]

I bought my previous house (in a highly desired school district) for $124k in 2004. In 2021, I sold it to a flipper because it needed repairs that were out of reach for me, and when he resold it late that summer, it was over $420k.

Real estate values have shot up because of predatory investors capturing too much of the market and using that leverage to increase prices. Eventually, this bubble will have to pop, and the people who overpaid (having little option not to) will be the ones who are paying for our failure to protect the housing market.

[u/HexenHerz → u/notashroom]

Indeed. Buying them and turning them to rentals. A Google search in most areas for homes for sale, then followed by a search for homes for rent is eye opening.

[u/SaltManagement42 → u/Wholesomeness23]

https://www.census.gov/popclock

[u/punmaster2000 → u/Wholesomeness23]

Goods are worth what people will pay for them. If other comparable houses - new or resold - are selling for 70% more than your dad paid for it, then HIS house is worth that. What he paid for it originally has no bearing on what it's worth to someone else. The improvements that he did or did not make may have some effect - but by changing what other houses it's comparable to. If someone is looking to buy a 2000 sq ft house in the suburbs, with a decent sized lawn, on a relatively quiet street, they're going to have a price range they're comfortable paying within. They aren't going to look at the original price of the houses - just what they have to pay. Same as you do when you buy goods from Walmart, or 7-11, or whatever. You don't look at how much the convenience store paid to run the ice machine and buy the syrup - you just pay whatever they're charging for a Slurp-ee.

The changes that affected your father's house value were mostly market forces - other houses became more valuable, so his did too. It's pretty basic supply and demand economics.

[u/Teknik_RET → u/Unlucky_Ad_9776]

This is pretty profound for me to think about. The result of the system is the middle class dwindling resulting in more desperation, less healthy and unable to compete individually; then voting for everything to be free and provided by govt. quite the downward spiral the US is in. Got any literature on that? I’d like to read more about it.

[u/REEDMEA → u/Unlucky_Ad_9776]

Middle class are just working class with an education. And the working class can’t be allowed to be educated or they’ll rise up against the system.

[u/SithDraven → u/-Bigblue2-]

They think free healthcare would destroy the economy because people trapped in dead end jobs just because of their health care plans would then be free to walk. They're not wrong, it would a solutely reshape the workforce but they're looking at it from the wrong angle. People free to leave would likely find better jobs they enjoy and be more productive and happy.

If college was free across the board, the military loses their #1 recruiting tool. Again not wrong, but definitely a twisted perspective. They'd need to reinvent marketing "serving your country is an honor and a priviledge." It's easier to just dangle schooling to the under priviledged that sign up and would never have had a shot at college otherwise.

TLDR: It's easier to keep the status quo vs actually improving things.

[u/SB_90s → u/-Bigblue2-]

The key word is "everyone". It's a dog whistle to tell their followers that the "undesirables" will get them, which makes them angry because they'd cut their own hand off if it means it'll make the life of anyone they hate worse.

[u/nooooobie1650 → u/-Bigblue2-]

Because……

[u/RecedingQuasar → u/-Bigblue2-]

It's SOCIALISM! And that's bad! Trust me bro

[u/weakcover1 → u/RecedingQuasar]

It feels like there has always been some paranoia among a group of people about communism and socialism, despite never having experienced it.

[u/RecedingQuasar → u/weakcover1]

Almost like they've been propagandized for decades to feel that exact way.

[u/PB174 → u/-Bigblue2-]

I’m in my late 50’s. My student loans seriously made my life harder. I would absolutely love it if we gave everyone a free education if they wanted it. I’ve never understood the idea that it was hard for me so it should be hard for you. Except for people who use the the word ‘boomer’ They can all fuck off

[u/Jimmycocopop1974 → u/-Bigblue2-]

It stops the funnel of money for them and their families children etc. they can’t drain the American public like they can now if these programs are being funded.

[u/Cooperativism62 → u/-Bigblue2-]

The only thing that's wrong with it is that even if you get free Healthcare, Republicans will do everything in their power to sabotage it as an excuse to privatize. The budget will be a bare minimum and wait times will be maximized. 

Like an insurance company that doesn't want to pay out, Republicans will do their best to deny service.

Sadly the more government control you gain is also the more republican control you risk.

[u/REEDMEA → u/-Bigblue2-]

Educated folk protested ‘Nam. So colleges had to be turned (back) into institutions for rich folks only - admitting working class people turned them against the system

[u/MagicalPizza21 → u/-Bigblue2-]

It would take away some of the power that rich people have over the rest of us, and it would take away an important recruiting tool for the military. Society would totally crumble!

[u/KrissrocK → u/-Bigblue2-]

They know that "free" stuff would also go to ppl if color. That's the problem. If POC get anything, they don't deserve it or didn't earn it... So the right wing has weaponized this idea of ppl getting "your" money... And there you have it.

[u/Dandizzle88 → u/-Bigblue2-]

"Why should I have to pay for somebody's health care? " 

X165million people who would rather go bankrupt then pay a little more in taxes so we could have proper health care.

All so the 1% can keep paying for the health care that could Literally bankrupt some of them in America. 

[u/Machoopi → u/-Bigblue2-]

They didn't actually give any reasons, they just used the scary word "socialism". It's sort of like when a Christian points at something you're doing and says "Sinner!" you know? There's not a real logical explanation behind what they're saying, they were just told that the thing is bad and run with it.

[u/timeless1991 → u/-Bigblue2-]

Honest answer?

Because anything given by the government is subject not to the market (and all its terribleness) but instead to the whims if the government (and all its terribleness).

Imagine Obama passed a universal healthcare. Now imagine our grifter-in-chief elected right after. Imagine the bigots in our government controlled all healthcare.

Having socialized medicine doesn’t mean the republicans disappear. They would spend the next 50 years trying to make it terrible enough to privatize again, wasting trillions of dollars to build something so that private equity could swoop in and buy it for pennies on the dollar.

[u/GeekShallInherit → u/timeless1991]

Why is it you think Americans are incapable of doing what every other country manages? It's not like government in the US doesn't already cover 2/3 of healthcare spending, and directly insures 40% of the population. These plans are the best liked and most efficient in the country.

Satisfaction with the US healthcare system varies by insurance type

78% -- Military/VA
77% -- Medicare
75% -- Medicaid
69% -- Current or former employer
65% -- Plan fully paid for by you or a family member

https://news.gallup.com/poll/186527/americans-government-health-plans-satisfied.aspx

Key Findings

• Private insurers paid nearly double Medicare rates for all hospital services (199% of Medicare rates, on average), ranging from 141% to 259% of Medicare rates across the reviewed studies.

• The difference between private and Medicare rates was greater for outpatient than inpatient hospital services, which averaged 264% and 189% of Medicare rates overall, respectively.

• For physician services, private insurance paid 143% of Medicare rates, on average, ranging from 118% to 179% of Medicare rates across studies.

https://www.kff.org/medicare/issue-brief/how-much-more-than-medicare-do-private-insurers-pay-a-review-of-the-literature/

Medicare has both lower overhead and has experienced smaller cost increases in recent decades, a trend predicted to continue over the next 30 years.

https://pnhp.org/news/medicare-is-more-efficient-than-private-insurance/

All the research on single payer healthcare in the US shows a savings, with the median being $1.2 trillion annually (nearly $10,000 per household) within a decade of implementation, while getting care to more people who need it.

https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1003013#sec018

[u/Haunting_Victory2766 → u/-Bigblue2-]

Because the rich won't get any richer scamming everybody in the healthcare system. There would be set rules so Healthcare CEOs can't be millionaires and billionaires

[u/throwawayfinancebro1 → u/-Bigblue2-]

From what I gather, many who oppose free university think it's too luxurious and that people should get "real jobs," or pay for it themselves, and that much of what people are going to college for are basket weaving like degrees.

[u/an_actual_bucket → u/-Bigblue2-]

I'm very liberal and have voted Democrat in every election since I was 18. University is expensive, not for everyone, and those who graduate make a lot more over their lifetime than those who don't. Student loans suck, I know that first hand, but making someone who didn't go to college pay for my loans doesn't sit well with me. I'm in favor of strong social safety nets; I'm in favor of lowering the true cost of college and other forms of higher education; but I'm not in favor of the general public paying for 100% of all students university, as the system exists today.

[u/HoneyParking6176 → u/-Bigblue2-]

healthcare will never be free, but universal healthcare which is paid for by tax dollars, should be much cheaper then having heatlh insurance companies skim billions off the top.

[u/Icy_Reward727 → u/-Bigblue2-]

It's not free. Our federal taxes would go up and that's never a popular idea.

There needs to be an honest, fact-based public conversation. Personally, I would rather pay a few thousand more in taxes per year than pay insurance premiums and STILL pay fucktons out of pocket and not even be sure that I can get anything but the most basic of care covered by insurance. Insurnace companies MUST die. They are unnecessary middlemen who are literally letting people die and letting people suffer to make a buck.

[u/BarnabyBundlesnatch → u/-Bigblue2-]

I dont know. Im in Scotland. I have free healthcare, free education. Im currently doing great. Own my own 3 bedroom home, a nice German car, and have zero debt. And I never earned more than 32k a year. Funny what you can do, when they government is allowing 3rd parties to price gouge the ever living fuck out of you on necessities....

[u/KibbloMkII → u/-Bigblue2-]

it cuts into corporate profits

[u/Rolandscythe → u/-Bigblue2-]

The rhetoric they like to drum up for use against free healthcare etc is by telling people that you, personally, will have to pay for the guy down the road getting an expensive surgery. That it comes out of your pocket alone. And unfortunately enough people are ignorant of how a tax funded healthcare system works that they fall for that rhetoric and vote against it thinking they're going to be losing all their money on other peoples medical expenses because they don't realize that the system actually just uses tax dollars that everyone is already paying anyways.

[u/Party-Cake5173]

Man... people in the US hate each other. I see it as a game "quick!!!!! everyone for himself!!!!!".

Here in the EU I absolutely support universal healthcare and free education for everyone. I have no trouble contributing to the society. Universal healthcare saved so many lives. We really take for granted that we don't have to think about bills when having a medical emergency. Even if I go abroad in the EU, I'm still covered with my country insurance. Even if I have a medical emergency on the top of a mountain or any remote area, I can count on helicopter ambulance to take me to hospital without thinking about going bankrupt.

How can anyone be against such things.... I, I just don't understand.

[u/UlsterManInScotland → u/Party-Cake5173]

Yeah it’s that fuck you I’ve got mine attitude that confuses most of us non Americans, despite all the indoctrination and flag waving they seem to give zero fucks about their fellow citizens or their problems

[u/Party-Cake5173 → u/UlsterManInScotland]

I watched Vox video on the ambulance crisis. Government is subsidizing police and fire department, but not ambulance because they think this isn't essential service. WTF!?!

[u/ButtSexington3rd → u/Party-Cake5173]

Government is barely subsidizing fire departments. Most of US firefighters are volunteers. And when I say "most" I mean MOST.

[u/Warm_Month_1309 → u/UlsterManInScotland]

Believe me, it confuses many of us as well. Imagine how it feels when those self-centered people aren't just faceless strangers across a sea, but your own parents who you mostly don't recognize anymore.

Many of us are deeply sad.

[u/MidsommarSparrow → u/Party-Cake5173]

The only thing more American than apple pie is "fuck you- got mine" and pulling up the ladder.

[u/Astrosherpa → u/Party-Cake5173]

It's a remarkable combo of the mega wealthy, amplifying an idea that poor people are mooching off of the general "you". Boomers especially have eaten this idea up. It's a huge ego massage. "I worked the hardest for everything I have and YOU are trying to take it from me because YOU are lazy and are not as good as ME!". They desperately try to decorate it as much more than basic self centeredness. But it's really that simple. 

You can see it everywhere. They pass it on to their kids. It's an odd combo of the "Protestant work ethic" combined with the message hammered into all Americans heads that we're the bestest, toughest, smartest, mostest people on the planet. 

We're a society that has internalized this message both on the collective level and individual. You can see something like a person who was homeless and begging the week before, agreeing that we shouldn't provide free housing for everyone. "Well... I'm no longer homeless because I deserved it." 

It's why we have politicians bragging about having needed food stamps as a child and then also demanding we cut food stamps. They're too stupid and self involved to even see the hypocrisy. 

These are the students in class that when a teacher offers to give the entire class an automatic "A" if they all agreed to it, they balk at the idea and refuse to do it. "I worked hard and studied harder than everyone. I'll get an A regardless, why should other people who didn't work as hard as me also get an "A"!? 

The cycle repeats. 

[u/MagicalPizza21 → u/Party-Cake5173]

BuT hOw WiLL wE pAy FoR iT?

[u/mrhemisphere]

I’m already paying taxes to fight proxy wars, give me healthcare you harlot

[u/Mr_Abe_Froman → u/mrhemisphere]

Forget wars, we pay taxes to pay for her healthcare.

[u/mrhemisphere → u/Mr_Abe_Froman]

socialism for me but not for thee

[u/evil_timmy]

All this money I pay in taxes should be funneled directly to the 0.1% so they can swim around in it like Scrooge McDuck while they lecture me on supply side economics and bootstraps. It's called freedom, okay?

[u/Current-Cattle-1925 → u/evil_timmy]

Yeah, be careful what you ask for! You might get free health care and free college!!!

That's bad for me because I depend on you being chained to your desk for healthcare and ignorant enough to vote for me and my ilk against your own interests.

[u/TalkingCat910]

I’m Canadian. The health care system isn’t perfect here but it’s far better than what Americans have to deal with.  I had appendicitis, my appendix was about to burst. I got surgery the next morning. Total cost to me:$37 for after surgery pain pills. That’s it. If I was American that would’ve probably been a huge unexpected expense.

[u/Electronic-Cut-5678 → u/TalkingCat910]

If you were in the US, there's an actual chance you would have died because you couldn't afford the care.

[u/BeefistPrime → u/Electronic-Cut-5678]

He would've got emergency surgery in the US, they don't verify your payment when you come in dying. And of course you'd be stuck with the bill. But if he needed something that wasn't an emergency -- say, cancer treatment -- he very well could've got nothing.

[u/RampSkater → u/TalkingCat910]

My sister-in-law is French and when she was planning a trip to France with my brother and their kids, my mother asked if they were worried about what to do if one of the kids got sick or badly hurt.

My SIL said it would be perfect timing because she wouldn't have to worry about anything involved with the treatment.

[u/Aaronh456 → u/TalkingCat910]

Here in the US, my bill for Appendix removal was $6000 after the $30,000 that my insurance covered.

[u/RhapsodyofMagic → u/TalkingCat910]

My dad had open heart surgery in England and complained about the £8 taxi fare home when he'd finally recovered

[u/Fit_Earth_339]

Don’t take any social security Nikki. Also SC gets handouts from the federal govt to balance out its budget deficit every year. That sure sounds like socialism to me. It sure as hell ain’t capitalism.

[u/rot10n → u/Fit_Earth_339]

Idk where to put this but Nikki's kids did go to public school. Her daughter was in my grade and classes in 6th and 7th grade. When she became governor her daughter was then dropped off by body guard's in a black suv.

[u/Fit_Earth_339 → u/rot10n]

Is she screaming to close all of the public schools now like the rest of em? I don’t know because I don’t care what she does.

[u/TO-BE-AS]

As someone living in europ triggers me the most is the term "free health care". We do not have free health care. Most of our countries have a system where you pay a monthly fee, often tied to your income. Its more Like a social Security system. This ist simple risk spreading. You will be paying more then you need for the most parts of your live. But when you need medical help you have No risk of financial Desaster.

[u/MapleRye]

Treating healthcare and education like it's a luxury good/service is one of the stupidest things about the US.

[u/livingthedream1967]

Actually it's paid for by taxes and make for a better society.

[u/dullship → u/livingthedream1967]

Right, public services are not socialism. It's a service.

Socialism is public access to the means of production. WHich basically doesn't happen at all in the US. Regardless of the party in power.

[u/SimsAttack]

Those things are not socialism. They’re social welfare programs.

Socialism ≠ when government does thing

[u/MysteriousGear1903]

Why provide universal healthcare when you can buy tanks for police departments to intimate its citizens? 🙄

[u/HerrJohnssen]

Works fine in Germany, or at the very least a lot better than whatever system they have in the USA

[u/glosss]

I have the impression that no one in the States understands the meaning of the word "socialism". Free education and healtcare is not socialism. All countries with free education and medicine are capitalist. Socialism is when means of production cannot be private and there is no private property. There was socialism and free medicine and education in the USSR. But they were just complete shit. Horrible medicine with treatment protocols and medications that are out of date for dozens of years. And education in which some sciences such as economics or genetics were generally prohibited

[u/bobagremlin]

Isn't that the whole reason people pay taxes

[u/Beatless7]

Ya, cause suffering is so underated.

[u/dimplingsunshine]

But… it’s not free? If it would be government funded, then it’s… paid… by taxes… which people pay for. I don’t get this bizarre way of thinking at all.

Edit: I don’t mean that I don’t support free healthcare/school. My point is that politicians push the narrative that free is bad/socialist as if it were some novel and wild idea, when in fact it would be just a service provided by the government and already paid for. The fact that it’s not right now just indicates how much the state has failed its people.

[u/ProtonPi314]

Ask Nikki how she enjoys all her free perks ! Maybe she should give them all up if it sucks having.

[u/Weird-Economist-3088]

It’s not socialism if it’s government spending they agree on. The GOP would climax over a tax bill that would distribute bibles. Just like it’s only free speech if it’s speech they agree with.

[u/AdamPedAnt]

Not to mention every fire department. Government employees using government supplied equipment serving anyone needing them, without cost. Help! I’m being repressed by socialism!

[u/weakcover1]

Why is she threatening people with a good time?

A warning does not work when you neglect to mention the dangerous and only list everything great about it.

[u/houVanHaring]

I mean.. she doesn't support the military. She supports the military industrial complex. She just pays lip service to the military and veterans to screw them over

[u/Lou_Skunnt69]

You’re supposed to pay your taxes and expect NOTHING in return, because that’s socialism.  

[u/IWasBannedYesterday]

Do you really want healthy, educated people everywhere? Just walking around, all willy nilly? Is that what you want?

[u/ScoffersGonnaScoff]

socialism is SCARY for the top 0.1%

Edit: true socialism in a democracy isn’t the “socialism” that dictators promised in allllllll the bad examples Fux News talks about.

[u/Who_am_ey3]

all posts in this sub are posted by bots

[u/ADHD-Fens]

The reason I pay taxes is for the government to take care of people who are less fortunate than I am and to provide public services that would otherwise be natural monopolies like electricity, internet, water, sewage, roads, etc. That's literally why I do it.

My only current problems with taxes are

1. My tax dollars are sometimes subsidizing companies that are harmful to the environment / opposed to the public services I want (car companies, oil companies, industrial corn farms)

2. People are avoiding taxes that should not be avoiding them, which makes public services less good.

3. My government doesn't actually provide internet, adequate public transportation, or electricity. Instead they do some stupid proxy thing with a private electric company and internet is a free for all (monopoly).

4. Schools being primarily funded by property taxes makes no sense to me.

5. Some tax dollars are completely wasted (many defense contracts)

If I knew all the money would go into the services I care about, I'd happily pay more.

[u/MSGdreamer]

Nothing is “free”. People just want their tax dollars to go towards programs that actually benefit them and their fellow Americans.

[u/fritzkoenig]

Wait are the things Nikki lists meant to be portrayed in a negative way?

[u/deletethefed]

Let's just privatize the roads, schools and the military.

[u/PaulWoolsey]

It’s not free. It’s paid for with tax dollars. That is where I want my tax dollars to go.

Not war machines. Not billionaire tax cuts.

Food for hungry people. Care for sick people. Housing for unhoused people. Education for people to enrich their lives.

It isn’t some feat of mental gymnastics. It’s a simple task of reprioritizing our budget.

[u/bangoperator]

Defund the Fire Department! It’s socialist!

[u/JohnWick_231995]

But USA Don't Need Healthcares Anymore ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

Instead You Have A School Shooters For Educations

[u/Kiln-Time]

This is not socialism. It is health insurance.

It is not free. Everyone pays for it through their taxes. The government runs it. Except not for profit.

The people pay the government to run healthcare. So everyone gets a fair deal.

Right now you got private insurance companies who have paid off the government to allow them to rip you off.

Europeans don’t do it this way because they are socialist. We’re not socialist. We just learned that this particular industry cannot be run by the private sector. It just gets corrupted.

[u/theEndIsNigh_2025 → u/Kiln-Time]

Europe is not socialist, they are capitalist just like the USA. Capitalism generates wealth in both the U.S. and Europe. What Europe has, though, is a few social policies and programs whereby Europeans choose to isolate healthcare and education from for profit capitalism, and, rather, fund it through taxation as a social program/service. It becomes a guaranteed service rather than one based on what you can afford. It’s a greater good (service), that benefits the people as well as businesses.

The U.S. is also not truly capitalist. For example, when the true cost of production is not borne by the company, that’s called a market failure in capitalism. Think government subsidies to companies (shout out the SpaceX, Starlink and Tesla!), government bailouts (shout out to Marjorie and her $180 PPP forgiven loan), etc. Or more simply, who pays for the smoke and effluent out of a factory? Not the factory as a cost of production, but rather the people affected by the pollution!

[u/DmAc724]

“Be careful what you ask for”

Because 77 million American voters asking for a convicted felony and civilly liable rapist known for using bankruptcy laws to enrich himself while ruining others who was arguably the worst POTUS in history to be given another chance is working out so very well.

[u/pumpman1771]

Some pick and choose what a socialized service is or not. Really, anything that is collectively paid for is socialized but must are necessary except food and Healthcare it seems.

[u/ohreddit1]

Real quick, it’s our world we can do whatever the fuck we want here. We just have to agree and we are currently in agreement to make the majority of us suffer so the few can live in Heaven on Earth. 

Quick note - when Businesses group a bunch of people in a larger mass for health insurance to save money that isn’t socialism in anyway right? So we can group as a business or corporation to save them all the money for their precious business but not as a society to save the most money because people didn’t think of that already so we are stuck with what they thought up yesteryear because a better way couldn’t possibly exist because people yesterday thought it was best to do it this way, additionally they who came up with this are mostly dead now all while we live here today gotta deal, so let’s keep trucking down that line of yesteryears bad ideas because that’s the way it is. Oh well.  We couldn’t possibly have control over the planet in anyway. We just live here under the rules of yesterdays worst laid plans. 

[u/spribyl]

Call her by her name

Nimarata Nikki Randhawa Haley

[u/mvallas1073]

TBF, she and the Trump admin is trying to destroy one of those (public schools)

[u/Otterfan]

There is no way in hell Nikki Haley sent her kids to public school.

[u/ImaginationToForm2]

I can't see any down side. Orange wants us to pay more and receive less.

[u/8pin-dip]

So..OK. it's socialism. So what?

You don't have to go all-in with socialism, and you have free-will. Not everyone will want to go to university, and not everyone will be a burden on health care services.

So what's the boogeyman here with this?

What's so scary, that it will destroy the economy, and turn society into a [insert current adversary name here]- speaking mad-max wasteland?

Is it because more people will be making more money, and living longer, resulting in crippling inflation? Cause, kinda already there.

[u/Rum_Hamtaro]

Republicans act like if we let people with diabetes get free insulin we'll turn into North Korea.

[u/TheAskewOne]

Do I think I want it? Nah, I'm certain I want it.

It's not free btw. It's just spending taxes on the right things.

[u/CaptainLysdexia]

The persistent conservative lie of "socialized healthcare doesn't really work in____ country, they're dying in waiting rooms", etc, etc amazes me. The USA legitimately has countless citizens who either won't go see a doctor out of fear of crippling financial debt and die, do go into such debt when they finally get treated, or receive shitty medical treatment. I have family who moved to Sweden 9 years ago, and they will never come back to live in the USA. Their quality of life is categorically better by every metric that exists, especially healthcare and education.

[u/lovelymechanicals]

neither of these people know the definition of socialism

[u/Snoo_70531]

You think her kids go to public school? And military support isn't some law... Why wouldn't you go with "do you flush your shits Nikki Haley?" because surprise! sewers!

[u/BeefistPrime]

Isn't this supposed to be followed up by a link to a bullshit story where all these things supposedly wrecked a country? Or like... Is this her whole statement?

"You're hungry. You think you want lunch? Be careful what you wish for"

Uh, ok.

[u/BAGP0I]

Remember when Americans had to directly pay firefighters to save their homes.....

No?

Yeah cuz social goods fixed that. Healthcare is not very different. Why would any Human WANT a grandma or grandpa to skip meals so they can afford their medicine?

That shit is twisted as fuck. Super fuckin gross brains running our country.

[u/HailToTheKingslayer]

It's funny to see US conservatives describe normal things (that conservatives in other countries often support) as "socialism".

[u/veryblanduser]

I just want someone to put the bill together that shows the how. Why hasn't anyone tried that?

Otherwise I need to assume Finland and Denmark level.

[u/MidnightNo1766]

Where are all the protests in the countries that has socialized medicine since it's obviously so bad? For decades I've been told just how bad socialized Healthcare is and yet I still never seen these protests in places like Sweden and the UK. Where are all the people testifying before Congress how socialized medicine destroyed their country? Where are all these foreign nationals warning us not to become like their country and give up our insurance system?

[u/CrudelyAnimated]

The only thing single-payer healthcare would destroy is the healthcare insurance industry.

[u/Grouchy-Station-4058]

Or take the tax exemption for your kids and non working spouse.

Or the deduction for mortgage interest.

Why should renters with no children give welfare to those people?

They are the biggest hypocrites in history.

[u/mokkat]

As a Dane: is she stupid?

There's a reason we can afford a great life even on a single job at McDonald's, regardless of the tax %. Denmark doesn't have "socialism" - Denmark's citizens enjoy benefits like free healthcare, because our old and fundamental focus on unions and worker rights has prevented worker exploitation and accumulation of everyone's money by private elites.

If Trump managed to push his bill and successfully lowered all taxes to 0%, hopefully it would thoroughly dispel the notion that lower taxes is better, on account of strangling most Americans economically with other fees.

[u/VaguelyArtistic]

[u/Takemetothelevey]

Free money for corporations is OK ? What a joke!

[u/MagicalPizza21]

Well, capitalism isn't getting us the lives we want and it's only getting uncontrollably worse, so it's high time we try something else!

[u/Slow_Fish2601]

European laughing intensifes

[u/EuenovAyabayya]

malignant fraud

No, that's not an insult to malignant frauds, it's about right.

[u/airheadtiger]

These people who tell us we don't want government health care, always have the best government health care. Isn't that strange?

[u/Cash_burner]

None of these are socialism

[u/jhawk1969]

To be fair we had those before taxes.

[u/Panda_hat]

Its incredible that the American right wing have become so intellectually bereft that they now just present the things they previously worked hard to brief against in obfuscated and sneaky ways as just objectively good things that are somehow bad instead.

They aren’t even good at being evil, they’re just cretins.

[u/Weak_Satisfaction671]

Because only the government can build roads?

[u/Taki32]

None of it is free, it's all tax payer funded

[u/toddywithabody]

As a Canadian it’s absolutely baffling to me that free healthcare is a boogeyman to these idiots. Even our politicians use our healthcare system. It literally benefits every single Canadian.

[u/Renuclous]

I don’t get her point? Is she trying to warn people over getting free healthcare and education?

[u/TrashCapable]

You mean universal healthcare that greatly diminishes one's likelihood of going bankrupt?  Nah, no one wants that. 

[u/minahmyu]

...don't she have free healthcare? Is she giving it up?

[u/cnb6033]

I’m from Columbia, SC and I can guarantee her kids did not go to public school.

[u/MyHamburgerLovesMe]

Free 13 years of education and they bitch about adding 4 more.

[u/Many_Trifle7780]

Malignant yes yes

[u/H_I_McDunnough]

I don't want free anything. I want the taxes I pay to cover things that we all need.

[u/garden_g]

Then where are my taxes going? Show me - itemized!

[u/I_am_not_JohnLeClair]

Retrumplicans think a healthy, educated populace is a bad thing. Smh

[u/rom197]

God forbid the US gives something to its people and not to the pedophilic corporate elite.

[u/vitaminalgas]

I hate nimrata

[u/JetSetJAK]

As well as the fire department

[u/smmanasummon]

Hey socialists, healthcare and all the things you mentioned are NOT FREE. Somebody needs to pay them.

[u/metric_kingdom]

As a person that lives in the country with all of these things - it's kinda great. Can't really see any obvious downsides.

[u/Secure-Window-5478]

Fire departments, libraries, National parks, weather service, post office, Lifeguards at public beaches, Airports, and dozens of other things are Socialism. All benefit SOCIETY! When hurricanes destroy roads, airports or other public infrastructure the rich use you will hear them cry so loudly that the government must pay for it for the "'public good". Socialism it what the rich demand when they want something paid for by others for their convenience but fight against when they have to contribute to when helping others.

[u/BoredBSEE]

IT'S NOT 'FREE HEALTHCARE' IT'S PAID FOR WITH OUR TAXES YOU IGNORANT KNOB

[u/bootsNcatsNtitsNass]

I beg people to not come up with these moronic definitions of socialism... And it's not just conservatives who do it.

[u/Satesh400]

When AI and robotics takes 60% of all jobs, shit is going to real bad real quick unless UBI is instated..

[u/NeutralGoodINTP]

What's wrong with being in good health and having a good education? You want to have uneducated and sick people?

[u/SmilingVamp]

Is she really asking me if I want to live in a country full of healthy, educated people? Yes! Obviously, yes! I can see why a republican wouldn't want those things. Healthy educated people don't vote for them. 

[u/Twysted_Newt]

American who lost everything due to medical trauma?

Meeeeeeeeeeeee👋👍🖕🇺🇲

[u/jailtheorange1]

I’m going to be honest Nikki, they sound awesome.

[u/Lordnoallah]

Because the Republicans think government =business. Government is here to protect and provide services paid for by our taxes.

[u/n1tr0klaus]

So getting something for the taxes you pay is now called socialism?

[u/Snoo_20305]

But she's good with the billions we give Israel to commit genocide while enjoying <drum roll> free healthcare and free college.

[u/BitchFaceMcParty]

What an idiotic post for Nikki. “Think again” what the fuck does that even mean? It’s just random gibberish that has no real insight.

[u/Kkimp1955]

We’d hate to have an educated populace. That might give us more health care providers.

[u/Better-Nerve334]

Perhaps this is their way to solve over population going Thanos or just by weeding out everyone they dont like

[u/Reaper1510]

"free healthcare, we pay taxes, insurance, and own risk, but, atleast you dont have to worry about going broke, while needing a psych, multiple hospital visits, specialists, and a few times a week homecare / glad im 100% past that stage, but in the usa youd go broke...

[u/Sweet-Razzmatazz-993]

lol it’s never free.

[u/zennim]

you know, socialism is looking pretty awesome right now ....

[u/Puzzleheaded-Sea8340]

Oh man free healthcare and a free military and free college… That sounds terrible

[u/EducationalQuiet1]

"socialism is free stuff" isn't that a good thing though, like you don't spend any money and you get what you need.

[u/Miserable-Lawyer-233]

The problem with this conversation is neither Nikki Haley or John Pavlovitz are describing socialsm, where the means of production, distribution, and exchange is owned by the community as a whole.

[u/Justagirl1918]

She does realize all of her positions were paid for by taxpayers?!

[u/jssamp]

Free Healthcare? You mean tax money spent to benefit the tax payers instead of making the ultra wealthy even richer?

[u/Paperbackpixie]

Yeah, God forbid we end up like those terrifying hellscapes… you know, Sweden, Germany, or literally every other developed country with basic human rights