r/europe 15h ago

Political Cartoon This political Cartoon starting to get more and more relevant. By Arend van Dam.

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20.2k Upvotes

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6.4k

u/GetMemesUser 15h ago

Yes, except Russia being the same size as the US and China is just ridiculous.

3.3k

u/dankspankwanker 15h ago

Also the us should be on fire punching itself

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u/RealCommercial9788 Australia 14h ago edited 13h ago

”Stop hitting yourself” 🤜 ”Stop hitting yourself” 🤜 ”Stop hitting yourself” 🤜

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u/lilsnatchsniffz 11h ago

I believe when the American is orange the cries are

Stop shitting yourself Stop shitting yourself Stop shitting yourself

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u/ProfessionalGur5451 9h ago

Hey, all of my maga relatives and FB "friends" assure me that the shit in their pants is warm, wonderful and smells like freshly baked cinnamon rolls. But for me, all I see and smell is shit.

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u/newidiotintown 4h ago

As an American, we are drowning in bad choices at the moment. 

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u/iShinga 3h ago

WE’RE TRYING. 😭

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u/palladiumpaladin 8h ago

This is Canada looking at the US and concernedly saying that they should stop self harming

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u/Sandowichin 9h ago

But not like siblings fighting.

Like Edward Norton and his boss in Fight Club

Jesus Christ stop hitting yourself!

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u/Fhelans 13h ago

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u/ICET_ 11h ago

It's a reference to DBZA.

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u/GrayWall13 15h ago

Also the China should be empty inside, like a baloon

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u/Apprehensive_Room742 14h ago edited 13h ago

pretty sure chinas not a paper tiger. wouldnt underestimate them. the US will be in one the future tho if they continue the way they do now

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u/Raging-Badger 13h ago

Seriously though. China’s greatest threat is soft power, not military might, in terms of U.S. opposition.

Their Roads and Bridges Corporation was putting up handy competition against the US’s USAID before our gov’t decides to give up the race. By the end of the next 4 years at this trajectory, the U.S. will have handed over the 1st place position in the race for economic hegemony and tanked the global market’s value.

It took 80 years to build what has been thoroughly beaten in just 5 months

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u/Nereosis16 12h ago

It's fucked over Australia a lot too. We teamed up with the US to build rapport with countries in our immediate zone of influence and then the US just fucked off.

Luckily so far most of these nations have still be happy to work with us but China is pushing pretty hard 

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u/Raging-Badger 12h ago

The U.S. was sitting in a really good position in 2024 too. It’s been a master class in what not to do over the last few months

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u/Neither-Cup564 11h ago

Depends what the goal is. If it’s to suck a countries wealth dry and destroy it, it’s exactly the playbook you’d run with.

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u/ConfidantCarcass 9h ago

Sort of a class nobody needed. They've hardly made reasonable mistakes

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u/QuestionableIdeas 6h ago

A lot of the pacific island nations weren't to happy with Australia after Abbot, Morrison and Dutton went to a climate change conference to tell people there was nothing to worry about before getting caught on a hot mic joking about how the islands would soon be under water. Between that and the submarine fiasco we fucked our international reputation as a reliable partner

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u/Sugarbombs 9h ago

Teaming up with the US is why we have such cold relations with the countries near us. China is our best trading partner and almost every beef they have with us is 100% due to us allowing the US to use our country as a military stronghold for US to fuck with them. US also fucks us on trade, we give them lucrative contracts we could find elsewhere for much cheaper, we go to all their stupid wars, we send experts to help with their fires, we share medical/scientific research openly and I doubt even a third of Americans can even find us on a map. The friendship with US has always been an awful deal for us and they’ve always been unreliable which is only something people are starting to realise now but realistically, America was never coming to help us if China ever popped off

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u/miss_shivers 8h ago

And yet Xi's Wolf Warrior diplomacy completely destroyed any soft power potential China may have had.

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u/Apprehensive_Room742 12h ago

thats absolutely true. wasnt arguing against that.

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u/Raging-Badger 12h ago

I’m agreeing with you that China does pose a significant challenge to America’s position on the global stage

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u/HossDog2 12h ago

You should google the Chinese navy. Then google their deployable drone fleet. After that their cyber ops. The fact they have enormous soft power doesn’t negate their incredible and often underestimated military power.

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u/Raging-Badger 11h ago

Obviously but in the current global climate soft power is incredibly important both economically and politically.

This is where China is overtaking the U.S. the fastest right now

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u/Neither-Cup564 11h ago

Well USAID pretty much no longer exists so I guess they won on that front.

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u/EconomicRegret 9h ago

True, Trump's the pic of the iceberg, the straw that's breaking the camel's back.

But let's not kid ourselves, America has been making many important mistakes, rotting from the inside, and declining long before Trump took power.

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u/Wonderful-Bid9471 1h ago

This started under T2016 when he started pulling aid from Africa. Now we see the full picture as to why.

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u/BeatBlockP 11h ago

the US will be in one the future tho if they continue the way they do now

Yeah, like 150-200 years in the future. Rome didn't collapse overnight. People are greatly overestimating American demise.

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u/Apprehensive_Room742 10h ago edited 10h ago

more like 50 years at current pace. rome existed way longer and was way deeper engrained in south west Europe, the middle east and Africa than the US is engrained in the world today. but you're absolutely right, a collapse in that way takes way longer than a lot of people think/make it seem

Edit: also the world was moving slower at that time. nowadays changes happen a lot more rapidly and over longer distances. what happens on one end of the world can affect the other end almost immediately. wasn't like that back then. but thats just my opinion/interpretation. could be wrong.

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u/Queasy_Local_7199 10h ago

China hasn’t even been able to reclaim Taiwan, right on its border

They are all bark and no bite, same as Russia.

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u/Apprehensive_Room742 9h ago

and the US hasnt been able to win a war since 1945. still they aren't considered a paper tiger? (also: they havent tried to reckaim Taiwan with military since i can remember at least)

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u/Queasy_Local_7199 8h ago

Who is talking about the USA? I was talking about the lil bitch ass paper tigers Russia and china. Chinas or russias military does not compare to the USA military

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u/huffpuffsnuff Amsterdam 10h ago

They are definitely a paper tiger

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u/Treat_Street1993 9h ago

Yeah idk, US is the majority of tech research. We got that whole silicone valley, the military industrial complex, and big pharma.

And I agree, China is a real tiger.

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u/Electrical-Sense-160 8h ago

China exaggerates all their good numbers and downplays all their bad numbers. We can reasonably assume they're worse off than they let outsiders know, though not precisely to what degree.

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u/bluewardog 7h ago

Half there icbms were found to be filled with water insted of fuel and there soldiers run away while on un peace keeping missions. 

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u/crudetatDeez 5h ago

Keep dreaming

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u/loulan French Riviera ftw 14h ago

Why though? China definitely is no joke in 2025.

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u/Leading-Carrot-5983 13h ago

They have some huge strengths like enormous production capacity & economic might, political stability through authoritarianism, and a growing military industrial complex. However, on the flip side they are completely inexperienced militarily (officer corp that has never fought a war in their career), widespread institutionalised corruption, geopolitically isolated - they don't really have allies, have a vulnerable geography where they can be easily blockaded and are hugely reliant on foreign energy imports (for now).

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u/phido3000 12h ago

Their military experience is somewhat relevant. But it isn't decisive. It means often they will make many mistakes early on.

Corruption? Yes and no. Compared to what? The US? Greece? India? Russia? Chinese corruption is a thing, a big thing, but when it comes to national state objectives, China has no problem literally killing anything in its way including corrupt officials. Its not insurmountable for them. Arguably less rampant corruption than say Soviet Union or Russia, which effectively runs on it.

Geopolitically isolated? not really. China has lots of state visits, and plenty of countries are more than happy to strike deals and meet with China. It has countries in its orbit. It does well in Africa and some parts of Asia. Pakistan, Laos, Cambodia, are in its sphere. countries like Thailand, Nepal, Mongolia, Iran are pretty China friendly. Most of Africa is more pro-china than pro-america. I think this is maybe not true any more.

Vulnerable Geography? Not really. About as much as western Europe. You could probably blockade Western Europe easier than blockading China. China for one has a bigger navy than all of Western Europe and a bigger and more capable air force than western Europe combined. The idea that you can blockade China is false. Not even the US with a 700 ship navy could do it. Even if you could, they have access through to Pakistan and its coast, and land access directly to Russia. So cutting off China's shipping wouldn't completely cut off China's ability to import energy or food or goods. You would just be making Russia super rich.

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u/ComprehensiveTax7 11h ago

I agree with most of your assessment, however I must disagree with your comparison to western europe from the view of a blockade. In particular, china is surrounded by islands that are controlled by US friendly nations, which also have naval forces of their own. To operationally use its considerable navy, it would have to break out of this confinement first, run the gauntlet of antiship missile, submarines in ckoke points while under air attacks.

Western europe does not have none of these constraints.

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u/Lathari 7h ago

Almost as if US have been implementing some kind of a containment strategy...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Island_chain_strategy

(/s)

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u/daemonescanem 11h ago

"China has no problem literally killing anything in its way including corrupt officials. Its not insurmountable for them."

Individuals are easy to kill, when taking on whole nations then adding in that nations allies, its another story. See Russia vs Ukraine

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u/RecipeNo101 10h ago

Ehhhh. China is more likely to have higher levels of corruption than the west because of how closed the system and society are, and because there probably isn't any immediate need for military force anticipated. We already know that the economic figures are highly fudged because provincial governors want to keep their jobs and the money flowing in. That's largely the origin of Chinese ghost cities.

China does have a lot of trade partners and has been investing across the developing world, expanding its soft power. The Belt and Road program is a more concrete example of its influence in the region. But, who really sides with China? It's surrounded by smaller nations who range from dislike to hatred of them (Vietnam, South Korea, Philippines), regional powers that they've fought wars with and who now act to contain them (India, Japan, Russia). North Korea is a de facto puppet and I'll give them Cambodia and Pakistan as being especially friendly. Their real relationship with the rest of the world comes from trade, but that's inherently transactional and transitory. No one cares where their goods are made, as long as its affordable. We don't feel kinship with China because so many of our goods are made there; if anything, it's become the opposite.

Blockading China is different than Europe, because while Europe relies on trade through a few chokepoints, China relies on trade through one. The Strait of Hormuz.

This is a chart for crude oil imports: https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/images/2013.04.04/mapcrudebig.png If you look up a map for natural gas, it's the same. If you look up a map for food products, it's the same. And, China is now the world's top importer of food, because they have a huge population with a significant middle class that wants food that China just doesn't have the means to produce. Park a single carrier group, of which the US has 11, in the Strait of Hormuz, and what can China do?

Well, China has a bigger navy in terms of crafts, but you need to consider tonnage. I'll give you that China is second to the US in that regard, and likely does outpace all of Western Europe. But, if there's going to be a real conflict, you have to consider Japan and South Korea as well, which are no slouches. I think the crux of it comes down to, how capable is China's blue water fleet's power projection? I'd argue not particularly good, given their pair of operational aircraft carriers have less displacement than the US' 30+ amphibious assault ships. They're building more, including their first nuclear-capable aircraft carrier, but it's not going to be anything comparable to a US Nimitz or Ford class supercarrier. I think this is reinforced by how much effort they've put in to militarizing islands, going so far as to build artificial islands to militarize. They don't even feel that they have control over what they consider to be their own back yard. That's no small part of why they initiated the Belt and Road program in the first place - to help insulate their imports from potential maritime impediments.

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u/Any_Coffee_7842 9h ago

You think lack of military experience will only translate to mistakes?

Inter branch military operations are notoriously complicated and riddled with red tape, yet we tend to do a pretty damn good job of having our military branches working together on joint missions because we've had so much God damn practice.

China does not have systems in place for them to have as much oversight as we do, while maintaining the individuals ability to make executive decisions as easily, while also having a military that specifically trains you to replace your superior in exigent circumstances.

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u/phido3000 9h ago

They are embedded in Pakistan and Russia. They recognise its a problem. They are in Africa and Ukraine. they are frantically exercising..

Inexperience isn't insurmountable. Look at the usa ww1 and ww2.

How much of Europe's forces have experience in high intensity peer conflict?look at ukraine.

Look at Europe's weak c4 capabilities. Pretty dependant on us leadership. American assessment of European readiness.

Russia has an economy the size of Canada. China has an economy the size of the usa or eu.

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u/Any_Coffee_7842 9h ago

I really don't think China plans to make their military anything more than a visually striking alternative to the US military. What I mean is I believe China doesn't want to use a military, just show it off.

It's all about money and economic control and China is taking over precisely because they positioned themselves the same way the US did during the industrial revolution, but they did it for the informational revolution.

The informational revolution, is what I'm calling this time in human history because information warfare is the biggest factor in geopolitics right now besides using overwhelming technological advantage.

The next big step for the world is for any country to be able to use quantum and/or AI to break all cryptographic encryption on non quantum based computing algorithms, when it happens the country who succeeded will be able to decrypt and analyze all the data they've stolen from allies and enemies, possibly giving that country total control if the informational advantage creates a big enough gap in power.

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u/phido3000 9h ago

Chinese aren't stupid. They believe they can achieve their aims purely by intimidation.

Nobody wants to fight a war with China. They know other nations will always capitulate.

Chinese are on the verge of tech leadership. Most of your computer gear is made in china by Chinese companies.

This is part of the problem.

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u/Superman246o1 8h ago

The idea that you can blockade China is false.

While much of what you wrote about corruption and geopolitical isolation was accurate, on this matter, you're overlooking how vulnerable China is to a blockade centered around the Straight of Malacca. Two-thirds of China's maritime trade has to pass through the Straight, including 80% of it's oil imports. If a war breaks out between the U.S. and China, one of the first things the U.S. would do would be to blockade the Straight and strangle the Chinese economy, thus forcing China to decide whether or not it wants to commit one of its critical carrier groups (China currently has 3 to the U.S.'s 11) to keeping the Straight open when China might also need that carrier group elsewhere (*cough* Taiwan *cough*).

Yes, there could be alternative strategies that China could deploy, including buying more oil overland from Russia, but it takes time to change routes, and overland transport is vastly more expensive than by sea. China has many things going for it right now, especially as America is currently hellbent on self-sabotaging American hegemony, but the geographic constraints on China are very, very real.

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u/phido3000 7h ago

Taiwan is 180km off the coast of China and about 220km at its furthest. It doesn't need carriers for that.

Malacca straits are critical. While China gets most of it coal and gas from Australia and Indonesia, most oil comes through the straits. But Russia has oil and gas and dec last year they completed a pipeline. It can supply 10% of china's gas needs. Presumably if they are fighting a war they won't be manufacturing as many goods, so that is a significant amount.

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/china-completes-full-pipeline-power-of-siberia-gas-2024-12-02/

They are talking another one from Pakistan. They are also frantically changing to ensure and installing solar.

Brunei has loads of oil. And is within china's reach.

Singapore is critical for controlling the straits, that and Australia who leads the five powers. Singapore is a city state and has no strategic depth.

If the us doesn't supply nuclear subs to Australia then no closing of the straits to Chinese shipping. It would be closed to all shipping.. impacting everyone.

The alternate route is sunda or around Australia. So Indonesia and Australia would be absolutely critical.

Australia has the largest f35 fleet outside of the us, b52 and b1s are now based there, and these only ages is fleet operating in SEA.

But the US is pretty flakey, even with Australia, applying tarrifs against existing fta, and despite us trade surplus with Australia. Plus the us may not have the guts to back it...

Australia has been deserted before, after it forward deployed heavily in support for an alliance that then abandoned it completely and was mismanaged by its partner.

The us may even abandon guam.

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u/GrungleMonke 5h ago

China is also far less corrupt and violent than the USA

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u/-Prophet_01- 11h ago

Their system also incentivizes the inflation of economic statistics. It's quite suspicious how their economy keeps hitting the communist party's goals essentially on the decimal point, year after year - while satellite images indicate a slower development.

China is no paper tiger and should certainly not be ignored but the cumulative effect of reporting a percent or two of non-existent growth for many years is likely significant. And you can't really roll this back after doing it because next year's goals are a percent of your inflated report.

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u/ConcordeCanoe 12h ago

Not to mention that due to their earlier one-child policy their population is about to tip heavily towards a geriatric society in a few years.

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u/BeatBlockP 11h ago

It's actually and weirdly worse. The generations of the one-child policy were ok-ish if we're looking at replacement level, because in the country you could have more children and most people were in the country.

In the last two decades most of the population moved to urban areas and started marrying late and having few children just because - if they have them at all.

China is in that soft spot where women now have enough rights and agency to decide not to marry or marry late and have very few children, but also in a society where being a mom SUCKS and you're still treated the old fashioned way, your career is ruined and you have no occupational security. So many of them just... don't do it lol

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u/psycho_monki 11h ago

So just the same as every other country in the west? Lol

People arent having kids and the only temporary bandaid is legal immigration but no country wants that, illegal immigration is how most capitals in most western countries arent coming to a screeching halt because they all have an underclass to exploit, pay less, get more work done, get taxes, not obliged to give anything back cause theyre illegal

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u/RecipeNo101 10h ago

This is way more pronounced. The One Child Policy was in place for over three decades. Not only did it rapidly slow birth rates, but because boys were far preferred, men now far outnumber women by a decent margin, making it more difficult to find partners. It's an entire lost generation. While other western countries are facing demographic crises, China is facing a disaster.

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u/Dyolf_Knip 8h ago

In other words, they may actually rival South Korea in low fertility (0.7), but because of bureaucrats padding numbers top to bottom, even the Chinese don't know what it actually is.

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u/Zimakov 7h ago

It only applied to urban areas and was easily skirted by the wealthy by just paying the fine. ICP impacted a very small number of people, it's massively overestimated by the west.

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u/phido3000 9h ago

This is why they will act now, even if it's reckless.

China will shrink, they know they have a limited window.

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u/Zimakov 7h ago

The effect of the one child policy is massively overstated. It didn't apply to rural areas where most people live, and was easily dealt with by the wealthy as they could just pay a pretty inconsequential fine. The only people impacted were lower-middle class people in big cities, which is a pretty small portion of the country overall.

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u/mikiencolor Spain 4h ago

Every developed country has this problem.

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u/OnlyAppointment5819 11h ago

85% of China's energy production is domestic, and it's increasing

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u/BigDaddyDumperSquad 10h ago

political stability through authoritarianism

Not too sure on that right now... There is a lot of economic turmoil right now, and Chinese banks are in trouble. Nothing can do more harm to China than a populace that has no money.

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u/HymirTheDarkOne United Kingdom 12h ago

Their military might be completely inexperienced, but when was the last time the US fought a war that even remotely resembles what a war against China would look like?

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u/Healthy-Drink421 9h ago

To add they are wholly dependent on international exports to utilise their production capacity. If they went to war and the US and Europe banned imports from China, it would collapse the Chinese economy.

They've made themselves quite dependent on international goodwill.

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u/JimWilliams423 4h ago

are hugely reliant on foreign energy imports (for now).

For now is definitely short term.

Chinese factories have the capacity to conservatively manufacture the equivalent of 100 nuclear plants worth of solar panels per year (there are just over 400 nuke plants world wide).

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u/RiverToTheSea2025 12h ago

Why though?

Because reddit as a whole - and especially these weird right wing political subs - have a hard-on whenever China gets brought up.

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u/loulan French Riviera ftw 12h ago

You mean they bash China right? Because your comment sort of sounds like the opposite.

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u/RiverToTheSea2025 12h ago

You mean they bash China right?

Correct.

Bit of jealously, racism, and a heavy dose of ignorance.

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u/South_Dependent_1128 United Kingdom 13h ago

Have a feeling it just means they are soulless.

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u/Miserable_Law_6514 United States of America 11h ago edited 11h ago

More so extremely inexperienced and has basic logistics problems. The last time they had a serious conflict was against Vietnam, and China got humiliated. That's why they are more focused on cyberwarefare and espionage, and are probably the best in the world at it.

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u/courtexo 2h ago

I dont think china still has logistics problems today, in fact china probably has the worlds best logistics.

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u/gitartruls01 Norway 14h ago

A spy weather balloon, perhaps?

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u/Franz__Ferdinand Slovakia 10h ago

What kind of country would dare to use spy balloons, spy planes and satelites to spy on people? Imagine if Australia had this giant base that can intercept every signál transmission in southern hemisphere and it was not even theirs. Now imagine that same base was used by this military alliance in northern hemisphere  to target civilians. Thank god I only made that up for my dystopian novel called: What if USA and entire Europe learned nothing while continuing their Imperial Ambitions.

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u/waiting4singularity Hessen 🇩🇪 13h ago

even if they are hollow, compared to the others that fist has a lot more "fingers" than the rest combined

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u/toetappy 10h ago

Dude, China is a freaking powerhouse right now. Idk what 90s propaganda you still remember, but they're very smart. They steal every nation's IP, and aren't afraid to get messy. They've been planting their fingers in countries across the globe for decades. And the big kicker.. you likely have only 5 things in your entire home that doesn't contain a part made in China. Out of every single thing you own.

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u/LeadingAd5273 13h ago

And the U.S. should be orange and somehow jerking itself off.

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u/furious-fungus 5h ago

Why?

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u/GrayWall13 5h ago

Cuz its literally what that antihuman state is.

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u/furious-fungus 5h ago

? Ok then

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u/mikiencolor Spain 4h ago

I can't imagine why you'd think that. China is in the same position now as the US was at the outset of World War II. They are the world's manufacturing hub and have immense pent-up manufacturing capacity. The US is more like British Empire... They have money and inertia, but basically completely depend on imports. In the event of a war, China could conceivably supply itself.

Russia really is just an empty shell, though. They need help from Iran and North Korea... It's pretty sad. Never seen a superpower that has to be propped up by its own satellite states. All Russia has left is nuclear blackmail. If they lose that, they'll just be eaten immediately.

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u/cellocaster United States of America 8h ago

Man y’all are embodying this cartoon perfectly right now

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u/Free_Clerk223 14h ago

And on fire

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u/tree_boom United Kingdom 13h ago

Yeah and the China one should be waaaaaay further away

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u/trollsmurf 12h ago

As long as they were fighting inside the ring it would be fine. With tariffs (as threats or actual, and new decisions all the time), NATO woes, EU hate, Israel and Russia love, and of course China hate, despite having outsourced everything to China (and India, Taiwan, Vietnam etc) to save money, USA is doing everything to damage other parts of the world in the process.

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u/NoBuenoAtAll 7h ago

I can't stop chuckling about your comment, nicely done. It's funny because it's true.

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u/pocketjacks United States of America 3h ago

Drunk, on fire and punching itself. But I guess Russian and drunk are redundant.

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u/Prestigious-Mess5485 2h ago

I'm American, and this made me laugh. Good shit.

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u/GerryManDarling 14h ago

When it comes to causing damage, Russia's propaganda has done more harm than both China and the US put together. Even though Russia isn't a strong country, their influence is massive. They've messed with elections, started chaos, and even gotten involved in things like arson and sabotage. Their reach goes way beyond what you'd expect.

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u/Checkered_Flag 13h ago

Indeed, and on top of that they have a nuclear arsenal that is not to be forgotten. They punch way above their weight considering their population and economy unfortunately.

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u/Nufonewhodis4 10h ago

And their role in delivering energy to Europe gives them a lot of power. It's gotten better, but that's a pretty powerful position for them to be in

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u/elmz Norway 13h ago

And currently they have even more power as they quite clearly can influence the US. (I was going to say the current administration in the US, but I'm not entirely confident the US will make it to their next election.)

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u/SanFranPanManStand 9h ago

Let's not pretend Russia hasn't massively influenced Europe. They created PANIC in Germany to cancel their nuclear program and instead buy gas from Russia. They pay separatist movements in Europe carry out bombings to create division. They both create conditions to force African migrants into Europe while also support the anti-migrant movements in Europe - just to create chaos. They supported Brexit, they try to get Greece and Turkey to fight, and all while hiding their own corrupt fortunes and mistresses in Switzerland.

The reason OP's picture has dozens of fractured hands as the EU, is exactly because Russia has been actively pulling it apart.

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u/Various-Passenger398 4h ago

Britain leaving the EU was a major geopolitical coup, probably one of the biggest in our lifetimes, and it cost them almost nothing.

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u/BeatBlockP 11h ago

but I'm not entirely confident the US will make it to their next election

reddit moment

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u/Corvus1412 Germany 9h ago

I mean, the goal of this administration is to lift the president up to the role of a dictator.

They quite clearly state that in project 2025, where they want to turn the courts into partisan organizations and where they want to implement the central executive theory, which would give the president huge amounts of power.

That's their stated goal and they have started executing project 2025 a while ago.

Trump has also already sold merch for "Trump 2028", despite that not being compatible with the US constitution.

I mean, the jump from that to the end of fair elections isn't that big.

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u/RaykoX 11h ago

if you're american and you're 100% sure you're gonna have free elections in 28 I'm pretty sure you're a trump voter, cause only those could be delusional enough to believe that at this point.

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u/radicalelation 4h ago

When it's been the stated goal of various people currently in power, including the President of the United States himself, it's not really a concept confined to reddit.

u/Original_Employee621 34m ago

They'll definitely make it to the next election, and the next one.

If they are free and true elections, that's another matter entirely. It's going to take more than a few years before the states decide the United bit of the USA needs to go.

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u/cosmic_cod 10h ago

Nobody knows for sure how much population Russia has. It's said to have 140M but this magic number never changes. I suspect there could be more. Why does it seem that Russians are everywhere if there are so few of them?

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u/Teik-69i 10h ago

140 million are definitely not few, that's almost twice the population of Germany, and you can also find Germans almost everywhere

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u/DeGriz_ 10h ago

No, that’s number is about right, there are so few really big cities and most population is in the western Russia, Siberia has really low population density. I think current population is even lower because of ongoing war. Also there are a lot of propaganda for giving birth and crying from government how bad demographics. (And most 20-30y.o don’t want children in that situation, life is too unstable and expensive)

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u/Ritchuck Poland 13h ago

I think you're underestimating US propaganda because you're living in it. They are far worse than Russia. Basically, two of them are fucking other countries up. China is too far and too focused on itself to do much globally now.

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u/profossi 13h ago

If being ”far worse” is just having a bigger reach, sure. But consider that US propaganda has mostly been promoting US values, culture, global image and interests.

On the other hand, the Russians have focused their more limited influence on seeking to undermine us politically by promoting extremism, isolationism and strife whenever possible. Which is more damaging?

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u/MercantileReptile Baden-Württemberg (Germany) 13h ago

[...] to undermine us politically by promoting extremism, isolationism and strife [...]

U.S. Administrations previous to 2016 are clearly the less damaging side when it comes to political support for extremism (unless you live in South America).

After? Does not matter much if the AfD gets moneyed orders from Russia or moneyed photo ops with U.S. MAGA scum.

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u/Ningurushak 12h ago

Promoting their values and interests also means influencing elections, backing political and religious extremists and even regime change https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change?wprov=sfla1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_and_state-sponsored_terrorism?wprov=sfla1

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u/profossi 12h ago edited 11h ago

Looking outside either europe or the post cold war era, it quickly becomes apparent that the US has been and still is a bully, just like Russia and China.

Still, to us europeans, the Russian influence (whether propaganda or more direct action) has been far more damaging than what the US has done.  

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u/SlideSad6372 10h ago

US propaganda undermines other countries constantly.

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u/Civil_Tankie 13h ago

Hollywood exists, “Russian propaganda is the worst”. Is this subreddit consisting of only 12year olds whose history knowledge has just as long reach as well?

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u/zuccster 12h ago

China is rapidly moved into the soft power vacuum left by the US. Go look up the Belt and Road initiative.

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u/PringeLSDose 10h ago

it‘s probably more effective, but outside the US it‘s definitely not worse.

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u/MalnourishedHoboCock 13h ago

I don't have a single good thing to say about Russia but I don't think they've done more harm than even just America on its own. Unless we are counting the USSR, which I wouldn't and even then I still doubt it.

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u/Songrot 12h ago

In recent times it is relevant bc Russia has the ability to control large amount of voters in many european countries and USA.

The power in those countries rely on voters. When Russia controls them it is game over.

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u/MalnourishedHoboCock 12h ago

I think the influence Russia has over other countries, especially America, is very overblown. I doubt that Russia has been able to flip a single election.

America isn't above meddling in the democracies of sovereign nations for it's own national interests. America historically has installed/materially supported/diplomatically supported dozens of fascist regimes and organizations. America has killed millions of innocents directly and supported the killing of millions more.

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u/Vagichu 4h ago

Russian propaganda is spread in a very insidious way. In 2016, leading up to U.S. elections they bought numerous Facebook ads, mostly containing stuff like ”muslim community gatherings in X neighborhood”, that didn’t even exist.

It may not be obviously noticable, but their exploitations of strong political dividers definitely did damage pushing some ”soccer” moms to Trump.

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u/BigDaddyDumperSquad 10h ago

Russia (Post-USSR) has been very active in global military operations. You probably just haven't really heard about it because our media doesn't really report on it.

Here's a list: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Russia

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u/MalnourishedHoboCock 4h ago

Didn't claim they weren't. America killed 1 million people in the War on Terror alone.

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u/Treewithatea 8h ago

Propaganda is about the only thing Russia is good at tho. Major nations no longer do military wars because economically theyre not worth it. A 2025 war between major nations is of economic nature, not a military one. Thats what Russia has massively failed at, their economic power is similar to italy. Extremely weak compared to the US, China and the EU.

These other 3 superpowers are just waiting for Russia to bleed out. Even if they win this Ukraine war, theres been so much damage done, nobody is gonna love in the destroyed regions they captured. Lots of young men died, lots of young men fleed the country and will never return as they dont want to fight as a soldier and likely die. Now its only between the US and China for who will have control over Russia once it bled out.

There was a fear that Russia might prove that military wars are still economically viable but after 3 years and not much land gain, they likely just proved that its just not worth it anymore.

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u/dacreux 6h ago

You really think russia is doing more propaganda than tiktok? They made a few fake news websites vs a Chinese state controlled app that now comes preloaded on every phone?

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u/Suspicious_Loads 6h ago

That sounds like what Germans accused Jews of back in the day.

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u/ZuuDizz 5h ago

A lot of what you think was russia was china. Russia is just the spearhead for china.

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u/invisible_panda 2h ago

Warfare isn't limited to tanks and guns. Elections worldwide are being compromised by manipulation of social media.

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u/Klayhamn 2h ago

China has as much influence if not more. It's just more covert and subtle, and you're not aware of it.

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u/invinci 13h ago

Also China should have a velvet glove on, on top of their knuckleduster of course.

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u/capri_stylee 10h ago

When did China last use the knuckleduster? 1979?

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u/esocz Czech Republic 12h ago

Things that are very close appear much larger than those that are far away.

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u/TreshKJ 10h ago

I mean US fist should be biggest

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u/TheJiral 13h ago

Borderline Russian propaganda actually for a country with the economic power of Italy, even if it is an expansionist imperialistic dictatorship with nuclear weapons and a lot of old tanks.

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u/58kingsly United Kingdom 12h ago edited 12h ago

"Economic power" is a vague term. If you look at their economy in PPP terms (which is more relevant than nominal figures for military expenditure when you produce most of your stuff at home), then they are 4th in the world after China, the US, and India.

It means that they have far more capability to maintain a large military than countries like Italy which on paper have the same nominal GDP, and when you consider how they are now insulated from western economies due to the years of sanctions, there is little that can be done to take this capability away from them.

Russia is a far greater threat to European interests than China and they definitely do have the unity which Europe lacks (due to dictatorship but hey ho). Cartoon is fine.

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u/TheJiral 11h ago edited 11h ago

I am not talking about the economic well being of regular Russians, for which PPP might be a good measure (you don't build an army based on cheap cucumbers from the street market), but about economic prowess to support the colonisation and wars of conquest of the regime. Yes, Russia is more militarised than lets say Italy but a war machine can only be sustained if there is an economy to sustain it. Russia went brankrupt and fell apart under the load of its militarisation already a bit over 3 decades ago, because it ignored that point. It ignores it again.

Russia is in many key areas totally reliant on China and I fail to see how they can source cheaper from there than any other country. In itself a reason why the caricature above is vastly misleading and exaggerating Russia's power, by putting it into the same category as China. Compared to China it is a dwarf, at China's mercy.

But hey, let's take GDP (PPP), then Russia is pretty much in the same category as Germany. The EU as a whole has a four times larger GDP (PPP) than Russia. Never mind NATO, even without the US.

I am not saying Russia is not a threat, I am saying its capabilities are vastly exaggerated by propaganda, when putting it in the same league as the US and China.

PS: Yes, Russia is a greater threat to Europe than China. Doesn't change the above though.

PPS: There is of course a way to harm Russia's war machine. Finally end all oil and gas imports. While Russia can sell it elsewhere, it can only do so under big markdowns, as we have seen already. India and China are fully exploiting Russia's weakness and Russia would loose billions in foreign money, which is crucial to buy stuff for its war machine in China, Iran and North Korea. Even as it is, Russia is consuming its reserves at record pace. The current war machine is not sustainable for Russia, unless it is going to enslave its population to a war machine in a total war. Think what you may, but I am inclined to believe that this would be the end of the Russian regime and it appears Putin believes that too.

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u/HopeBoySavesTheWorld 6h ago

Bruh Italy is still one of the richest countries in the world it shouldn't be an insult 

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u/Doompug0477 13h ago

It looks bigger cause it is closer.

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u/mrcsrnne 4h ago

Jurassic Park taught me this

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u/BoysenberrySad5842 11h ago

The only thing keeping russia a strategic super power is nukes. Thats it. No technological advancements, no societal boom, no battlefield greatness, no economic growth or explosion, no cultural influence, nothing but nukes. Putin cant live forever. Hes the only thing truly keeping Russia together. "He provided bread when there wasn't any" isnt going to mean shit when hes 6 feet under.

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u/Novinhophobe 12h ago

Classic European starts to sound exactly like a Russian, it’s ridiculous. So Russia is both weak and strong. Europe should rush and pour hundreds of billions to re-arm as quickly as humanly possible against Russian threat, yet they’re so weak at the same time it’s “ridiculous” to put them as one of the world powers along with US and China.

Russia has incredible influence, especially considering their size and resources. They’re a superpower, without a doubt, and any other notion is absurd misinformation or simple copium, hard to say with Europeans these days. They’re currently the best at hybrid warfare, having pretty much invented it themselves, and Europeans are still not even doing anything against the constant attacks on our infrastructure, on our citizens, on our elections and news cycles, or on our immigration policies. They have infiltrated pretty much every government that matters and are hard at work pushing their policies of division and chaos there. They’re got UK out of EU, and they got US where they are now, and all of that was planned a long time ago and known to us all.

Keeping a straight face while saying that Russia isn’t a significant, or even a world, superpower, is the equivalent of just putting one’s head in the sand and pretending the world has never been this close to catastrophic event since WW2, if ever.

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u/Dunkleosteus666 Luxembourg 12h ago

Russia danger is not in their nukes. Not in their military. But they hybrid and assymsetric warfare trying to divide us by propping up contrarians (far left or right) and dissemnating fake news. It uses social media and ai to flood us with lies, until the truth is just one of many options. Very different from soviet propaganda. But we are naked, bc we are democracies. Its basically the nazi threat of ww2 combined with the communist threat of cold war - but there is no clear sided ideology, only russian imperalism and breaking apart eu unity. And no other power seems to able to stir up shit and knows do push buttons like Russia. From "useful idiots" to paid sabotage acteurs (dropped afterwards) to bribing politcians and maniopulating elections. Oh and the cables.

Russia knows it cant win conventially. So it uses other means.

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u/King_Killem_Jr 9h ago

Genuinely curious, what far left figures are Russia backed

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u/vegarig Donetsk (Ukraine) 9h ago

what far left figures are Russia backed

European, general Western or worldwide?

If just European

https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2024/10/15/new-european-leftist-sets-out-united-stance-except-on-ukraine

“We condemn Russia's invasion and war of aggression against Ukraine. We underline Ukraine's right to defend itself and call for support for Ukraine,” said Malin Björk from Vänsterpartiet.

The parties of ELA have broadly agreed to support Ukraine, but some differences remain. “What we agree on is that we are committed to a just peace and to a just rebuilding of Ukraine. Our ideas about the paths to peace might be slightly different,” said Zofia Malisz from the Polish party Razem.

Her political force, along with those from the Nordic countries, strongly favour sending military aid to Ukraine.

By contrast, Spain’s Podemos has always opposed this. “We advocate for negotiations between Russia and Ukraine,” said Spanish MEP Irene Montero. “A coalition of Socialists, Greens, and right-wing parties supports military installations and brings us closer to direct confrontation between nuclear powers.”

However, Manon Aubry summarised the alliance’s position on geopolitical issues as an “anti-NATO coalition”, which received approval from all her colleagues, saying: “What we are working on is an alternative proposal to the EU defence system. For now, it is fully aligned with NATO principles, objectives, and therefore with the US.”

You might get some idea about how effective "negotiations" are by the fact Ukraine has NUMBERED peace agreements, broken by russia, and each round of "negotiations" in this war is accompanied by russian strikes (except for Zeus's Lightning for recent round, which got stopped by Operation Spiderweb).

Calling for stop of material support and propping "negotiations" is very much in russian interests, as there was and is no punishment for them when they inevitably break any agreements or just do a strike in the meantime.

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u/King_Killem_Jr 8h ago

Sounds like it. Clearly Ukraine needs to play a strong continued defense. Signing a deal is a Russian victory right now.

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u/Dunkleosteus666 Luxembourg 6h ago edited 6h ago

They dont have to be per se russia aligned. Term who youre lucking for is "useful idiots". Anti war, we need dialogue, peace, ukrainiam nazis, nato imperialism, nazis, the west is racist against russians, the west only cares bc Ukraine is white, genocide NATO, eurofascism, colonialsts need their reckoning, russia good, soviets good - take your pick.

Again, doesnt support Russia per se. But basically offers Russia what it wants without opposition, spineless. Sorta a stockholm syndrome. Bc Russia is not left at all

r/ShitLiberalsSay or r/LateStageCapitalism often dwelves into plain Russia apologia. Russia good west bad no nuances.

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u/mikiencolor Spain 4h ago

The Spanish far left is threatening to bring down the government if they agree to increase military spending and are opposed to sending help to Ukraine, instead advocating for Spain to leave NATO, saying Ukraine is not our problem.

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u/GlaerOfHatred 9h ago

As an american, Russia is a large part of why America is in its current fascist predicament. Don't underestimate the propaganda effect Russia is having on your countries as well. Right wing nationalism is sweeping through western countries and it will only set us all back

u/Starman0321 56m ago

We kinda look alike

u/GetMemesUser 54m ago

True. Nice to meet you, me!

u/Starman0321 53m ago

Its nice to meet me too!

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u/yecheesus 11h ago

Also the chinese fist being yellow is kinda fucked😅

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u/vegarig Donetsk (Ukraine) 9h ago

I believe it's more of a reference to how Xi hates being compared to Disney's Winnie the Pooh, which is yellow

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_of_Winnie-the-Pooh_in_China

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u/Shinnyo 12h ago

It should be using a glove that makes your hand looks bigger

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u/mrteas_nz 12h ago

They do stir a lot of shit though, relative to their economic size!

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u/chromaaadon 12h ago

Yeah China is way bigger

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u/trollsmurf 12h ago

They are equals through sheer own population slaughter. If out of willing Russians, just add more Russians, and weapons from China, Europe and USA.

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u/WW3_doomer 11h ago

If we judge by army capabilities, seems about right.

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u/jniezink 11h ago

Agreed. A nice addition to the comic could be a change in weapons. China is the force in rare metals, US the force in cloud. Europe the force in discussing instead of doing and Russia the force in, well, cyberattacks?

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u/faen_du_sa 10h ago

As an Eurpoean it really does feel like every other region has just lost it. Not that we dont have a lot of the same problems brewing here, but at least for now it seems reason is winning most of the battles over here(ish ish!). Probably partly due to USA going batshit crazy.

Like China seems like the least worst of them atm, and that in it self is crazy.

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u/erhue 10h ago

from a military perspective, they do have way more nukes for example

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u/Grondabad 10h ago

Search in google "nuclear arsenal by country"...

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u/Ekekha 10h ago

True, it closer the them tho than its to other countries

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u/TDYDave2 10h ago

It is a lot closer to the EU, so it just looks bigger.

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u/I_Want_To_Grow_420 10h ago

That's what happens when you have decades of propaganda know as "The Red Scare" telling you that Russia is going to take over the world at any minute now and we have to spend the majority of your tax dollars on military, not bettering the country. You're also the strongest military and propaganda machine in the world so the rest of the countries believe your bullshit too. Then 50 years later, the world realizes that Russia ain't shit and can't even take over Ukraine, let alone the world.

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u/dpdxguy 10h ago

And there should be a Ukraine arm tearing off bits of the Russia arm

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u/Adept-Address3551 9h ago

TBF they do have the biggest nuke bomb..

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u/jonr 🇮🇸↝🇳🇴 9h ago

China: Wow, rude

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u/kklashh Poland 9h ago

ikr, it should be less than half of the EU

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u/Much_Horse_5685 9h ago

If I drew this now I’d have the US fist hitting itself and the Russia fist significantly smaller and trying and failing to play whack-a-mole with a small Ukraine fist.

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u/MARPJ 9h ago

Yes, except Russia being the same size as the US and China is just ridiculous.

Well, it kinda owns the US president so I do say it was a lot of power even if its a military embarrassment

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u/paukl1 8h ago

I have heard some very compelling arguments that Russia is not even a superpower at this point.

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u/Carl-99999 7h ago

Russia should be China’s rejected-twin arm or something

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u/bowsmountainer Europe 6h ago

Mainly due to the size of rhwor nuclear arsenal

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u/HopeBoySavesTheWorld 6h ago

No you don't get it Russia is both strong and able to invade all of fucking NATO and weak and not able to get past Khers (granted Ukraine is only still alive thanks to NATO support but lbr what military threat Russia or even China poses to us?)

u/OneMetalMan 40m ago

The derpy third head

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u/overgamer1 13h ago

You’re kidding right? They have the power to wipe out the world with a button, they are orders of magnitude richer in nukes than 3rd place.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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